Groomzybanshee
New member
Say money wasn't an Object is there anything that someone could do to an heui injector to advance it? Or are we at the heui limits with today's injectors. Please do not start a pissing match.
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Injectors.
- Thread starter Groomzybanshee
- Start date
Groomzybanshee
New member
Hey d!ck bag quit with the bs it was a serious question..
Sorry bout that, couldn't help it.
Very good question I might add. Can't wait to see what the experts have to say. I would say there is always room for improvement, but I'd say we are pretty much at the limits, for now,but give it a little more time.
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strokin'_tatsch
Member
Jason was working on some more stuff that should help the HEUI injector quite a bit.
Money no object, we are not at the limits yet. These injectors can still be made faster.
Money no object, we are not at the limits yet. These injectors can still be made faster.
HRT's ideas are similar to a few others, Hypermax, Farmers...
I find it funny so many people are so quick to jump on bandwagons.... makes me wonder why I read so so little any more....
Yes they can be modded, yes money no object, but it will never match commonrail technology.....
Remember, the 7.3 started the "electronic" diesel era.... and now commonrail is going to send it into another era all together....
Groomzybanshee
New member
I ran a certain set of injectors but blew it up before anything was figured out...
Derek@Vision Diesel
New member
There is more... but is it going to truely be worth it? It will soon be cheaper to swap in a 1000hp 6.4 than build a 850hp 7.3
Fuel only
Fuel only
Powerstroke Cowboy
Well-known member
From what I hear is the easy part is getting the fuel for the 7.3... The hard part is getting the fuel AND the ability to inject it fast and keep the injection pressures up... That is the tough part.. fuel quantity is easy but fuel Quality and Quantity together is not...
V-Ref
Active member
Interested in this thread too.
It'll be a shame to never see some of the 7.3 "secrets" and innovation fielded as pretty sure the 7.3 market isn't in a "growth" era.
Groomz-I'd say most of the low haning' fruit has been picked already ref HEUI improvments.
bigaF250
New member
Interested in this as well.
Hotrodtractor
Moderator
Since my name was brought up a couple of times in this thread - I'm going to make some comments that may not really answer the OP's questions - but its some info that I think people need to see and know about. Many people have asked me about the injectors that I have spent time and money on creating - I have no real desire to speak about them directly or specifically -but want to show some things about injection speed and control.
Here is the graphical representation of a standard set of 238cc hybrid injectors with an "80%" tip:
Now certain things can be done to those injectors to improve the injection speed - things like a larger tip, fuel side injector modifications, etc.... that is easy to do and the initial results show pretty substantial gains in flow rate across the board:
Now that's all well and good - we've got more fueling capabilities - but at the same time we have lost a bit of control resolution making them harder to tune for - you just can't dial down the tuning as quickly and easily in certain areas and the transition periods going from different ICP settings or PW times can be a little finicky - this is shown mostly by the sloping of the injection graph - its nice and steep from all angles and ramps up to some pretty significant fueling capabilities. The real trick is to continue with the modifications to the injector to improve upon that control resolution to make it better to drive, easier to tune, and overall more of a pleasure to own and enjoy on a daily basis with more power and RPM capability than what are current standard issue injectors:
Now before I get criticized - the first two graphs are actual data - I used actual data that I have to mimic the third graph for this example to make it a better visualization for everyone. This is the same volume and the same injector tip, and even the same "fast fuel" mods - but it has other things that have been tweaked to further improve the control. This is what makes a high flow rate injector more controllable and driver friendly - take note at how it has a much less steep fueling curve.
Now I brought up this information because myself and the vendors that I deal with for injection have been slowly working on improving the control-ability of the high flow rate injectors on our own time and our own dime. The injection rate that we have is well over 400cc of fuel in a very usable time window - the trick is controlling it effectively - I have no desire to give the OK to the vendors to begin shipping these injectors that are finicky to tune and control.
So if money was no object - well over 400ccs of fuel in a usable time window in a controllable package could be finalized and sold. We all recognize that its a short and dying list of people that even care any more about this - there is really no way that we can recoup the costs even at this point - that is why we are not rushing anything - its a losing battle on the money front and we are doing it for us - when things are ready - they would be available through the vendors that I work with.
Jason
Here is the graphical representation of a standard set of 238cc hybrid injectors with an "80%" tip:
Now certain things can be done to those injectors to improve the injection speed - things like a larger tip, fuel side injector modifications, etc.... that is easy to do and the initial results show pretty substantial gains in flow rate across the board:
Now that's all well and good - we've got more fueling capabilities - but at the same time we have lost a bit of control resolution making them harder to tune for - you just can't dial down the tuning as quickly and easily in certain areas and the transition periods going from different ICP settings or PW times can be a little finicky - this is shown mostly by the sloping of the injection graph - its nice and steep from all angles and ramps up to some pretty significant fueling capabilities. The real trick is to continue with the modifications to the injector to improve upon that control resolution to make it better to drive, easier to tune, and overall more of a pleasure to own and enjoy on a daily basis with more power and RPM capability than what are current standard issue injectors:
Now before I get criticized - the first two graphs are actual data - I used actual data that I have to mimic the third graph for this example to make it a better visualization for everyone. This is the same volume and the same injector tip, and even the same "fast fuel" mods - but it has other things that have been tweaked to further improve the control. This is what makes a high flow rate injector more controllable and driver friendly - take note at how it has a much less steep fueling curve.
Now I brought up this information because myself and the vendors that I deal with for injection have been slowly working on improving the control-ability of the high flow rate injectors on our own time and our own dime. The injection rate that we have is well over 400cc of fuel in a very usable time window - the trick is controlling it effectively - I have no desire to give the OK to the vendors to begin shipping these injectors that are finicky to tune and control.
So if money was no object - well over 400ccs of fuel in a usable time window in a controllable package could be finalized and sold. We all recognize that its a short and dying list of people that even care any more about this - there is really no way that we can recoup the costs even at this point - that is why we are not rushing anything - its a losing battle on the money front and we are doing it for us - when things are ready - they would be available through the vendors that I work with.
Jason
Buffalo444
New member
Subbed
96stacked&smoken
New member
VERY interesting
Lowdown89
New member
Very interesting Jason, I'm not even going to begin to say I know anything about injector tuning or modifying. But say I had my run of the mill 250/200s from casserly. Could they be modified in the way you are taking about to see gains from them and if so would it be more cost efficient than stepping up to a larger injector? I'm just looking for around 650hp and already being at 560 with the 38r I was unsure if just swapping to a larger/nicer turbo I could see that much so if I could have my current Injectors modified it sounds like a nice way to go. I could be totally wrong in thinking that's why I wanted to ask
bigaF250
New member
Jason, I think a s468 turbo on your truck would be awesome, a deffinate big jump from the 38R. Are you running factory rods or did you go billet?
MadDiesel73
New member
Ill say i cant wait to see what swamps 400/200's and dual pumps do with the compounds 
Lowdown89
New member
They are still stock. So I can't expect em to last to forever.... The only thing I will be doing anytime I upgrade is have bill tune it as safely as he possibly can. Im working on moving some other projects and junk I have to get another short block in the works to run good rods and try out a cam from gear head
bigaF250
New member
Very nice
