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Old 07-31-2017, 07:45 PM
223 223 is offline
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Default Honest 6.7 turbo talk For The People

hey fellas im not a big poster on here. Im also not new to the diesel world or building and racing of diesel trucks. Ive blown more than my fair share of money building diesel trucks. Some with better luck than others. lol live and learn.

Anyways to make a long story short. I have a 6.7 thats mostly stock.
I just drive it,play,and occasionally tow toys. Have a offroad desert truck we race and pulling the distance with the stock turbo is started to build up some serious anxiety. Knowing if its gunna get me on of these days at the worst time lol

Naturally not being able to leave anything alone started looking at turbo kits. i have personally been around 2015 swaps and h and s fixed vane kit bd mdp kit etc. So i knew there was alots of support. little did i realize the HUGE arguments and discusssion going on between vgt's and non vgt's.

I search the forums and find nothing but arguments most from people that dont know what they are talking about and others that get bashed for a opinion good or bad of one or the other.

I was really hoping to start this thread with a total HONEST opinion from people and there real life experience. With NON vgt and vgt chargers and kits.

Best way to do this is list of mods proper tuning (obviously very important ) dyno numbers track times overall drive ability towing why you chose the setup you have price egts etc ya get the point

i know what setup im going to buy and why. Honestly i wouldnt know what to think if i was just searching with no clue what i needed. There is big names pumping both sides of the field on here and every where else.

But curioisty has me and lets help the people that really need help getting setup with what fits there needs most and that dont really know what theyre looking at. Dont let them go to the local diesel shop and get a kit shoved down their throat that doesnt suit their needs!


Lets NOT bash everyone to bad lol and PLEASE dont be scared to admit to downfalls in any vgt or non vgt kits that you may experience!
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Old 07-31-2017, 08:05 PM
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it's really simple , what's right for one , might not be right for the other. typically thee difference is how much power you want vs how much response you want, and what your end goal is.

as well, i don't see very much argument about that here. most that post have run one or the other, and there are plenty of knowledgeable vendors here to support these types of questions.
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Old 07-31-2017, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigrpowr View Post
it's really simple , what's right for one , might not be right for the other. typically thee difference is how much power you want vs how much response you want, and what your end goal is.

as well, i don't see very much argument about that here. most that post have run one or the other, and there are plenty of knowledgeable vendors here to support these types of questions.
i agree 100% especially racing or building big power. But, with the power vgts are capable of is well surpassed the stock rods why would you want a fixed vane? serious question?

NOT bagging on fixed vanes either just looking for more opinions!
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Old 07-31-2017, 09:06 PM
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I went non vgt because of lower drive pressure. I do a lot of in town driving and rarely have a chance to hammer it and stay in it for long so boost gets high and then I let off only to get back in it so non vgt made sense to me. It isn't as responsive as vgt but with good tuning it is fun to drive. Mine is only 63mm on stock 11-14 fuel. I don't race it, pull it, and it hasn't been on a dyno but it is night and day over the stock set up so I'm happy.
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Old 07-31-2017, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 223 View Post
i agree 100% especially racing or building big power. But, with the power vgts are capable of is well surpassed the stock rods why would you want a fixed vane? serious question?

NOT bagging on fixed vanes either just looking for more opinions!
the only vgt available of bending rods at this moment , is a 6670 barder, and it's not the ideal driving turbo for a stock fuel guy , or stock rod guy.
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Old 07-31-2017, 11:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doo dah View Post
I went non vgt because of lower drive pressure. I do a lot of in town driving and rarely have a chance to hammer it and stay in it for long so boost gets high and then I let off only to get back in it so non vgt made sense to me. It isn't as responsive as vgt but with good tuning it is fun to drive. Mine is only 63mm on stock 11-14 fuel. I don't race it, pull it, and it hasn't been on a dyno but it is night and day over the stock set up so I'm happy.

My good buddy had a customer come in with h and s dual pump kit and also 63 non vgt on the same 11-14 pump. It ran awesome and the kit was absolutely gorgeous. I was pretty suprised on how quick it spooled. Especiallly remembering the old 6.0 we had a fixed 63 on... do you tow? Just curious I haven't rode in fixed vane 6.7 towing. I'm sure it's great was just curious about overdrive does it like a lower gear?
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Old 08-01-2017, 06:22 AM
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I've got a mpd kit 364.5 tuning from Craig at mpd. Truck runs great stock fuel for now, got the dual fuel just haven't installed it. It spools great and cleans up fast. Egt's run about 750 to 900 not towing. Trans tuning helps a lot with these trucks. It tows just fine will get anything moving with ease, the only problem is that towing at speeds around 70, 65 is fine just have to lock out 6. But you get up to 70 you and you need to run about 75 or 80 so it doesn't want to shift down to 5 all the time. 3.73 gears would probably help, running 3.55 with 35in rubber now.
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  #8  
Old 08-01-2017, 08:52 AM
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Mike hit the nail on the head. Everyone is different. two identical trucks with different owners doing the exact same things with them, and one will swear by a modded 15 turbo, the other will swear by a fixed vane. One will say stock 11-14 fuel works great, other will say it leaves much to be desired. one will complain about egt's, one won't even care. There's sooooooooo many ways to go about it, so many ways to think, so many up-sides and so few downsides to either route. VGT will ultimately be more responsive on the low end, fixed vane will move more air mid-top end. Depends on how you like driving, the environment you are operating in, and like 874652387456 other variables. personally I have driven stock turbo, modded 15 turbo, all size S300SXE's with different fuel setups, bigger(S400) singles with fuel and other supporting mods, and in my personal(not business related) preference will always fall to a 63SXE on stock fuel, and a 64.5SXE with a 15 pump or dual pumps. you lose a touch of low end oomf, but the way it drives is so smooth. Boost climbs instead of just jumping up, EGT's are never a concern. and the sound is intoxicating(kinda shallow but we all know it's actually important). Of course, good tuning is ALWAYS important, even on a stock turbo/fuel truck. shift points, lock up points, makes or breaks the driving experience. good tuning can make a ****ty setup seem great, and **** tuning can make an amazing setup seem like the worst thing ever. it all comes down to you though. There's no right or wrong answers in this debate.
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Old 08-01-2017, 08:54 AM
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Once someone coins an actual, measurable definition of "spools great", we can have an "honest" discussion on this topic
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Old 08-01-2017, 09:27 AM
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My advice would be to find a single vendor you trust, and use them for everything. Both VGT and non VGT setups have been proven time and time again on these trucks. My personal opinion would be to only go as large as a 64.5 mm non VGT if you want "stock-like" driveability. There will obviously be more lag than a stock charger, but proper tuning will minimize that. If you go with a VGT, Midwest's Streetmax X will spool similar to a stock 15+ truck, but have a ton more power up top.

I don't sell turbos, and I don't have ties to any vendor, so my opinion is pretty unbiased. On my old truck, I went with a VGT from Midwest for a couple of reasons:
-Best customer service. Period.
-All Ford parts with the exception of the mods to the turbo. Think about it, if you need a gasket, up pipe, etc. in the future, you can source it from any Ford dealer.
-Factory-like fitment with minimal modifications. (If you can read a shop manual, you can install this turbo in your garage.)

I ran Midwest's turbo for over 50,000 miles before I sold my truck. The guy I sold the truck to is still running it, and is very happy.

Regardless of which way you go, try and source the turbo and tuning from one vendor. Midwest writes tunes that are proven to work with their turbo, and they run very well. Sometimes, buying a turbo from company "A" and tuning from company "B" turns into a headache. That was my experience at least, and that's why I ran Midwest's tunes for years.
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