Any feedback on cncfab stage2 hpop?

lincolnlocker · Oct 15, 2017

TitoBandito78 said:
I have tuning from there as well and it does not make wise use of hpo, pw or much else. I know your truck runs good for what it is but I just think he tunes kinda silly in some respects. The lower pw tunes run better which tells me there's too much being demanded across the map.

Do I think you could make a 17 throw codes with a 250/200? Probably but you may also be in a spot where pulling back pw may improve everything too. Just my 2 cents. I'd not give up 17 reliability for any of these frankenpumps unless it's absolutely necessary.

agreed!!

live life full throttle

ja_cain · Oct 15, 2017

TitoBandito78 said:
I have tuning from there as well and it does not make wise use of hpo, pw or much else. I know your truck runs good for what it is but I just think he tunes kinda silly in some respects. The lower pw tunes run better which tells me there's too much being demanded across the map.

Do I think you could make a 17 throw codes with a 250/200? Probably but you may also be in a spot where pulling back pw may improve everything too. Just my 2 cents. I'd not give up 17 reliability for any of these frankenpumps unless it's absolutely necessary.

Exactly! That's why I don't want to use this SRP. Too much uncertainty. I wan't sticks that will be fine with a stock pump.

lincolnlocker · Oct 16, 2017

ja_cain said:
Exactly! That's why I don't want to use this SRP. Too much uncertainty. I wan't sticks that will be fine with a stock pump.

soooo, what are you going to do with that srp?

live life full throttle

Tim @ P.I.S. · Oct 16, 2017

emev0l said:
But you allow them to be a PIS dealer?

I have no control over who P.I.S. Decides to do business with anymore.

Tim @ P.I.S. · Oct 16, 2017

ja_cain said:
Like Jason said a while back, no reason not to run hybrids over a codes. I don't want to worry about oil supply when I go to do my injectors. 200/80's for me.

There are plenty of reasons to run A codes over hybrids. I have spelled them out time and time again. But some people just wear blinders like they are told to.

Tim @ P.I.S. · Oct 16, 2017

One last thing.....

AD, 175/80 A code(from PIS), and 250 hybrid (from PIS)

ALL HAVE THE SAME HPO CAPACITY. So one is not more “oil thirsty” than the other.

All there were supplied with different nozzles and all three shared the same internal fuel upgrades.

610psd · Oct 18, 2017

Tim @ P.I.S. said:
I have no control over who P.I.S. Decides to do business with anymore.

Why?

Dmstrucks02 · Oct 18, 2017

Tim @ P.I.S. said:
I have no control over who P.I.S. Decides to do business with anymore.

Would you care to elaborate?

610psd said:
Why?

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DZL JIM · Oct 19, 2017

Someone else has taken over PIS, Tim has moved on, he can elaborate if he wants.

ja_cain · Oct 19, 2017

Tim @ P.I.S. said:
There are plenty of reasons to run A codes over hybrids. I have spelled them out time and time again. But some people just wear blinders like they are told to.

I won't disagree that there a multiple advantages, but I am not so sure they are significant enough to really matter to me. I would be happy to give up so atomization and responsiveness for the ability to deliver desired fuel flow with an old tired hpop or tired hpop and leaky oil side o-rings.

It would be nice to see how much different the fuel flow is between a 200/80 and 175/80 at an icp of 2800 and 2000 rpm. That would be interesting info.

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ja_cain · Oct 19, 2017

lincolnlocker said:
soooo, what are you going to do with that srp?

live life full throttle

Not sure yet. I will most definitely have it rebuilt by someone, but not so sure I want to chance running such a heavily modified pump that wasn't derived from new parts. I'll let you know if I decide to part ways with it though.

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lincolnlocker · Oct 19, 2017

ja_cain said:
Not sure yet. I will most definitely have it rebuilt by someone, but not so sure I want to chance running such a heavily modified pump that wasn't derived from new parts. I'll let you know if I decide to part ways with it though.

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right on. thanks man! since the badger sr pump isnt happening with the hbj swap that was originally offered, i need a new plan for more oil. not sure if the srp/hbsr will be big enough for what i might end up running but it will definitely do 300/200s.. doubt it will do 400/400s but im going to be turbo limited anyway if i go that big... might have to plum the jr pump i have(still in original package and box it came in from the first batch of pre orders when it was released) with the adrenaline that has been in it for 100k miles.. lol.. that should feed enough oil to whatever size i go with..

live life full throttle

DZL JIM · Oct 20, 2017

ja_cain said:
It would be nice to see how much different the fuel flow is between a 200/80 and 175/80 at an icp of 2800 and 2000 rpm. That would be interesting info.

What pw?
I have some charts that could answer that.
Well, I have data at 3k psi and 3k rpm. Rpm is kind of irrelevant, sort of...
Pw plays a bigger role comparing the 2 than rpm.

ja_cain · Oct 21, 2017

DZL JIM said:
What pw?
I have some charts that could answer that.
Well, I have data at 3k psi and 3k rpm. Rpm is kind of irrelevant, sort of...
Pw plays a bigger role comparing the 2 than rpm.

I am thinking no more than 3ms. I would like to simulate the fueling requirements of a heavy pull up a steep grade at 65 to 70 mph. I feel 2000 rpm is going to be a good average for most trucks. You are absolutely right that pw is the major killer here, but RPM might start to play a major role at these pw's. I suspect 2000 rpm will not be significant enough though. If I am looking at this correctly the a codes should deliver 30% more fuel at these conditions, in a perfect world. We all know it's never a perfect world. Lol!

I would love to see that data if you could be so kind as to post it here. I appreciate your insight.

hucorey · Oct 21, 2017

Tim @ P.I.S. said:
I don't understand why people think the 175/80's are "oil hungry".

The hpo capacity is no larger than a stock AD injector.

And the CNC stage 2 pump from my understanding IS the MB pump. Or at least was told he went behind MB and had his builder build his too and cut MB out of the process. Of course only after all the R&D had been done.

The MB 20* pump is actually my pump. FOR THE RECORD and it took awhile for him to openly admitted it. Only because of screenshots on my phone.

No, they are not built in the same machine shop. The shop I deal with no longer sells him pumps. My best guess is he buys from Bostech now.

A long time ago (ignorance on my part for not doing more research on the guy) I thought he actually knew a thing or two about hydraulics. So....I gave him specs to make a 20* pump. He ran with it.

For everyone here, just ask him tech questions on how a hpop even operates, troubleshooting these systems. The guy has never even owned a pickup truck let alone any diesel truck in his life.

Do your research before you post false info.

I've sold many many sets of 175/80's and more than 50% of them have been problematic with low icp and higher than expected IPR. All other P.I.S. dealers (that I talk to) have told me the same thing. So we don't recommend them because of too many headaches from injector builder pointing fingers at the tuner and vice versa.

My pumps, the STG2 (20*) won't hold 300cc sticks. It's recommended 250cc and under hybrids. Very similar output to an Adrenaline.

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hucorey · Oct 21, 2017

TitoBandito78 said:
I have tuning from there as well and it does not make wise use of hpo, pw or much else. I know your truck runs good for what it is but I just think he tunes kinda silly in some respects. The lower pw tunes run better which tells me there's too much being demanded across the map.

Do I think you could make a 17 throw codes with a 250/200? Probably but you may also be in a spot where pulling back pw may improve everything too. Just my 2 cents. I'd not give up 17 reliability for any of these frankenpumps unless it's absolutely necessary.

Yes, 250/200's will throw low ICP code.

The only single pump I've ran that can actually hold up to 300cc hybrids is the Stealth SRP 1.1, assuming you have a good one. Anything else, your going to need twins of some sort. Or one of the billet housing pumps Gary made if you can actually get ahold of one.

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lincolnlocker · Oct 22, 2017

hucorey said:
Yes, 250/200's will throw low ICP code.

The only single pump I've ran that can actually hold up to 300cc hybrids is the Stealth SRP 1.1, assuming you have a good one. Anything else, your going to need twins of some sort. Or one of the billet housing pumps Gary made if you can actually get ahold of one.

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might add in there that the tuning was with max effort too.. you can make any injector run with any hpop. it just wont perform when trying to get max effort out of the smaller pumps and big injectors...

they are injectors. (not sticks) chummings/tampons have sticks

live life full throttle

superpsd · Oct 22, 2017

Most of these single pumps should be close to similar output as they are all 20° pumps except for the SRP1. 1/Dynoproven SR with the larger pistons. Didn't Charles run 400/400s with a stock 15° pump? Granted it wouldn't have the torque due to low volume at low rpms.

Chris2590 · Oct 22, 2017

I just bought one. I have Stage two hypermax injectors. When I was running a super duty hpop I was getting a lot of smoke and a check engine light in almost every tune. Now with this pump there is very little smoke and I only get a icp code in a hot tune. I don’t have ipr or icp numbers yet but the truck is a beast now with this pump. It made a night and day difference. I would highly recommend it.

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ja_cain · Oct 22, 2017

Chris2590 said:
I just bought one. I have Stage two hypermax injectors. When I was running a super duty hpop I was getting a lot of smoke and a check engine light in almost every tune. Now with this pump there is very little smoke and I only get a icp code in a hot tune. I don’t have ipr or icp numbers yet but the truck is a beast now with this pump. It made a night and day difference. I would highly recommend it.

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Do you know what a stage two consists of? I just took a quick look at their website and it didn't tell me anything. BTW, that is cool a new hpop cleaned them up.