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Old 07-12-2017, 10:30 PM
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Default 4400 springs

I tried searching to find the answer on here but didnt have any luck so figured I might as well make a post about it. Why do you guys that lower your trucks install the 4400 springs? Also, what shocks are y'all running with them? I'm planning on removing the rear block on mine but not swapping the springs at the same time so not sure if it will sit level or not with the stock springs and rear block removed.

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Old 07-12-2017, 11:49 PM
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Fairly sure you're gonna be nose high. Look up Jomax on here. He's got 4400# fronts with no rear block. I think he's a bit nose high, but getting a bit better as he settles them is his unique way. Not my thing, but I think they run them so as not to be terribly nose high with quite a bit softer ride. No clue about shocks.
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Old 07-13-2017, 06:12 AM
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I'm running no rear block, 4400lb front springs, modded bump stops and KING 2.5in shocks. Rides AMAZING vs stock. Rides even better then my old carli kit with coilovers.


Front end is now only 1/4in higher.




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Old 07-13-2017, 07:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Jomax View Post
I'm running no rear block, 4400lb front springs, modded bump stops and KING 2.5in shocks. Rides AMAZING vs stock. Rides even better then my old carli kit with coilovers.


Front end is now only 1/4in higher.




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Old 07-13-2017, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Jomax View Post
I'm running no rear block, 4400lb front springs, modded bump stops and KING 2.5in shocks. Rides AMAZING vs stock. Rides even better then my old carli kit with coilovers.


Front end is now only 1/4in higher.




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So the 4400s help get the front down and helps make the ride a little better at the same time, good to know. Hate to be "that guy" but what size are your wheels and tires? I'm trying to decide between 20x10 or 22x10. Had 20x12 on my 7.3 but not sure if I want to go that wide again

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Old 07-13-2017, 06:08 PM
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So the 4400s help get the front down and helps make the ride a little better at the same time, good to know. Hate to be "that guy" but what size are your wheels and tires? I'm trying to decide between 20x10 or 22x10. Had 20x12 on my 7.3 but not sure if I want to go that wide again

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Right now they're boring 18x9s with factory Michelins.


I'll be getting 20x10s soon.


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Old 07-13-2017, 07:01 PM
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I got ya.

Does anyone else make a shock for the lowered ride height? I know KINGS are suppose to be amazing but their price is amazing as well. Did some looking online and most people only do shocks for lifted trucks. Would I basically run just a factory length shock if I decided to do 4400s?

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Old 07-13-2017, 07:09 PM
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I got ya.

Does anyone else make a shock for the lowered ride height? I know KINGS are suppose to be amazing but their price is amazing as well. Did some looking online and most people only do shocks for lifted trucks. Would I basically run just a factory length shock if I decided to do 4400s?

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You could. The truck will bottom out hard on the bump stops tho
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Old 07-14-2017, 12:05 AM
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I got ya.

Does anyone else make a shock for the lowered ride height? I know KINGS are suppose to be amazing but their price is amazing as well. Did some looking online and most people only do shocks for lifted trucks. Would I basically run just a factory length shock if I decided to do 4400s?

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Your stock height shocks should still work as the Bump stops should hit before the shock bottoms out. Problem is, with a softer spring, the shocks will bottom out way faster. If you had fox shocks, maybe it would be fine. I never ran it with the fox shocks to be able to tell you.


I do know for the rear, you need to mess with the bumps stops Because after removing the blocks. The shock will bottom out before the bumpstops hit the axle tube.


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Old 07-14-2017, 06:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Jomax View Post
I'm running no rear block, 4400lb front springs, modded bump stops and KING 2.5in shocks. Rides AMAZING vs stock. Rides even better then my old carli kit with coilovers.


Front end is now only 1/4in higher.




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You need rims NOW. Lol
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Old 07-14-2017, 06:26 AM
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You need rims NOW. Lol

I know lol.. some reason it looks a ton worse in that pic.


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Old 07-14-2017, 07:40 AM
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Your stock height shocks should still work as the Bump stops should hit before the shock bottoms out. Problem is, with a softer spring, the shocks will bottom out way faster. If you had fox shocks, maybe it would be fine. I never ran it with the fox shocks to be able to tell you.


I do know for the rear, you need to mess with the bumps stops Because after removing the blocks. The shock will bottom out before the bumpstops hit the axle tube.


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Awesome. I reckon when I go to change shocks I'll go ahead and lower it down at the same time and possibly install some traction bars.

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Old 07-14-2017, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Jomax View Post
I'm running no rear block, 4400lb front springs, modded bump stops and KING 2.5in shocks. Rides AMAZING vs stock. Rides even better then my old carli kit with coilovers.


Front end is now only 1/4in higher.




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What's your 1/4" measurement based off of?

I've heard so many varying reports on 4400 springs. Some are nose high, some are level, some are slightly lower.

I'm pulling blocks and installing 4400s in my dually. It currently has 6000 front coils with the shorter rear blocks. It's front to rear stanch is perfect right now. Figured it'd drop it 2" all around and keep the look, just lower.

Definitely do not want nose high at all. But also don't want to raise the rear slightly to compensate. If anything, I'll cut a 1/2 coil on the front....
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Old 07-14-2017, 10:00 AM
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All this nose high chatter makes me laugh. Basically does your truck look funny or not lol.

Measuring from the fenders tells you nothing. The truck body panels are not manufactured level. distance from the fender to the top of the hood is different from the distance from the rear fender to the bed rail. When your fender height to the ground, front and rear, is equal, put a level on the bed rail. It wont be bang on level. Or if you measure fender gap, it wont match what your eye says is level. Also will be perceived as sagging.

To reinforce my point, does anyone really care what the actual measurement is? or do you just want the truck to look normal. Thats the difference between greek and roman columns. One is straight by dimension, and when you look at it from a distance, appears skinnier in the middle. The other has a designed bulge in the center of the column and to the eye, appears straight.


PS I HATE a$s low trucks...

Last edited by sootie; 07-14-2017 at 10:11 AM.
  #15  
Old 07-14-2017, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Strokersace View Post
What's your 1/4" measurement based off of?

I've heard so many varying reports on 4400 springs. Some are nose high, some are level, some are slightly lower.

I'm pulling blocks and installing 4400s in my dually. It currently has 6000 front coils with the shorter rear blocks. It's front to rear stanch is perfect right now. Figured it'd drop it 2" all around and keep the look, just lower.

Definitely do not want nose high at all. But also don't want to raise the rear slightly to compensate. If anything, I'll cut a 1/2 coil on the front....

I measured from the top of the tire to the wheel well.

Did you want a measurement from somewhere else?

Being you have a dually, your rear spring pack is probably thicker, so adding 4400lb springs to a dually should keep the rear end a bit higher.


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Old 07-14-2017, 11:19 AM
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All this nose high chatter makes me laugh. Basically does your truck look funny or not lol.

Measuring from the fenders tells you nothing. The truck body panels are not manufactured level. distance from the fender to the top of the hood is different from the distance from the rear fender to the bed rail. When your fender height to the ground, front and rear, is equal, put a level on the bed rail. It wont be bang on level. Or if you measure fender gap, it wont match what your eye says is level. Also will be perceived as sagging.

To reinforce my point, does anyone really care what the actual measurement is? or do you just want the truck to look normal. Thats the difference between greek and roman columns. One is straight by dimension, and when you look at it from a distance, appears skinnier in the middle. The other has a designed bulge in the center of the column and to the eye, appears straight.


PS I HATE a$s low trucks...
Don't disagree with you Ron. I don't care what the measurement is. Simply wanted to see if his measurement technique is the same as mine? Or basing it off a level on the bed.

To me, if the measurements (from top of tire to tdc of wheel opening) is close to being the same, then they "look" nose high. My personal preference for the measurement is 1.5" difference between rear to front. That LOOKS level to me.

That's also the difference on my dually currently. So I'd expect to drop 2" (or very close) in front by going from 6000 to 4400 coils. And also drop the rear by same amount by pulling blocks...

It's all about the look. No matter the measurement, I don't want it to look like it's a$$ low. Want the rear of the truck at 2wd height, so if I need to adjust lower to look level, I'm going to do it in the front.
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Old 07-14-2017, 11:22 AM
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Don't disagree with you Ron. I don't care what the measurement is. Simply wanted to see if his measurement technique is the same as mine? Or basing it off a level on the bed.

To me, if the measurements (from top of tire to tdc of wheel opening) is close to being the same, then they "look" nose high. My personal preference for the measurement is 1.5" difference between rear to front. That LOOKS level to me.

That's also the difference on my dually currently. So I'd expect to drop 2" (or very close) in front by going from 6000 to 4400 coils. And also drop the rear by same amount by pulling blocks...

It's all about the look. No matter the measurement, I don't want it to look like it's a$$ low. Want the rear of the truck at 2wd height, so if I need to adjust lower to look level, I'm going to do it in the front.
Gotcha. In my experience, a 3/4" rake is perceived level to the natural eye from front, side and rear view. my personal preference is 1" rake as yours is 1.5" -to each their own. I just like to be technical sometimes lol

Kind of like everyone has a different perception of what "spools good" is haha
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Old 07-14-2017, 12:42 PM
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Default 4400 springs



4400# no blocks, stock shocks. Still a hair taller in the front. But easily 2 in taller than a 2wd still

EDIT: whoops didn't realize I was in the 6.7 section hopefully it still helps
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Old 07-14-2017, 02:54 PM
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Going off of my bed rails, the back end is higher.




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Old 07-14-2017, 03:01 PM
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Going off of my bed rails, the back end is higher.




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Exactly my point, level argues with the tape measure .... in the end the EYE is right lol
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Old 07-14-2017, 03:06 PM
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Exactly my point, level argues with the tape measure .... in the end the EYE is right lol

So, does my truck look ass low to you?


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Old 07-14-2017, 03:08 PM
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So, does my truck look ass low to you?


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Looks level to me lol

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Old 07-14-2017, 03:09 PM
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So, does my truck look ass low to you?


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I cant comment as camera angle can change perception on a screen. I always start at the front corner, move to the side and then the rear corner to base my judgment.
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Old 07-14-2017, 04:27 PM
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You need rims NOW. Lol

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Old 07-14-2017, 04:42 PM
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Keep rubbing it in , I know! It's a slow process, work is insane. I still have the rear airbags, compressor and rear king shocks I have to install..


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Old 07-14-2017, 05:52 PM
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Keep rubbing it in , I know! It's a slow process, work is insane. I still have the rear airbags, compressor and rear king shocks I have to install..


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What air bags? Would like to get mine lower for parking and the ride.
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Old 07-14-2017, 05:56 PM
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What air bags? Would like to get mine lower for parking and the ride.

Just air bags to help with towing. I went with Hellwig Bigwig airbags. Double the size of the regular bags and 14in of travel. I don't have to worry about them limiting down travel or the ride..

Also, with how the truck is now with the factory size Michelins, truck is at 6ft 5.5in. It fits in a 6ft 6in parking garage which 99% of them are.

When I get the new rims/tires. It'll drop another inch.
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Old 07-14-2017, 07:30 PM
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Just air bags to help with towing. I went with Hellwig Bigwig airbags. Double the size of the regular bags and 14in of travel. I don't have to worry about them limiting down travel or the ride..

Also, with how the truck is now with the factory size Michelins, truck is at 6ft 5.5in. It fits in a 6ft 6in parking garage which 99% of them are.

When I get the new rims/tires. It'll drop another inch.
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Thanks. I have some airlift 5000, got them after moving some tile and not happy with the rear end drop with weight in the back. I need to look and see if I can make it them work without the block. I got some cradles for them and last time I looked I figured it wasn't worth the hassle. But getting into more parking garages would be nice. Several I go to are 6'8", I don't think they are uniform and I worry about dragging the roof.
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Old 07-14-2017, 07:38 PM
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Thanks. I have some airlift 5000, got them after moving some tile and not happy with the rear end drop with weight in the back. I need to look and see if I can make it them work without the block. I got some cradles for them and last time I looked I figured it wasn't worth the hassle. But getting into more parking garages would be nice. Several I go to are 6'8", I don't think they are uniform and I worry about dragging the roof.

I ordered airbags for a 2wd. Maybe see what brackets are different.


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Old 07-14-2017, 09:34 PM
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Dang it, Jomax. I gave you a perfect opportunity to post your "unique" spring settling process, and you didn't bite.
I agree on the measurement v look at the dang thing. Mine looks level most of the time and sometimes a$$ low, which I hate. I had an 800 pound motor in the bed and it looked really a$$ low. Put a tape on it and it was perfectly level from ground to wheel well. One day it'll get 5" OUO blocks and bars to go with the 2.5" Carli front springs and to satisfy my taste.
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Old 07-14-2017, 09:37 PM
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Dang it, Jomax. I gave you a perfect opportunity to post your "unique" spring settling process, and you didn't bite.
I agree on the measurement v look at the dang thing. Mine looks level most of the time and sometimes a$$ low, which I hate. I had an 800 pound motor in the bed and it looked really a$$ low. Put a tape on it and it was perfectly level from ground to wheel well. One day it'll get 5" OUO blocks and bars to go with the 2.5" Carli front springs and to satisfy my taste.

Oh I'm sorry. Here you go.




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Old 07-18-2017, 01:56 PM
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I ordered airbags for a 2wd. Maybe see what brackets are different.


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I finally crawled under. Looking at the mounting bracket, it currently sits on the shelf that the factory bump stop limits at. The shelf has a very similar radius to the axle tube. I think I could set the bracket onto the axle tube. It might require a little grinding on the bracket. It looks like the distance to the tube is more than the height of the block. This would also allow me to use the Daystar cradles. Now I need to get some 4400 springs.
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Old 07-19-2017, 11:56 PM
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I finally crawled under. Looking at the mounting bracket, it currently sits on the shelf that the factory bump stop limits at. The shelf has a very similar radius to the axle tube. I think I could set the bracket onto the axle tube. It might require a little grinding on the bracket. It looks like the distance to the tube is more than the height of the block. This would also allow me to use the Daystar cradles. Now I need to get some 4400 springs.

Nice. Mounting my airbags tomorrow evening/Friday morning. I'll make sure and post up the finished product.


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Old 07-31-2017, 07:28 PM
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I'd really like to do this soon. Anyone know if fox 2.0 ifp shocks will work? Or does anyone know the collapsed size so I can make measurements? Also, part number for the 4400 springs?
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Old 08-14-2017, 07:36 PM
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Has anyone experienced any front end sag after running the 4400s for a while or had any driveline/alignment issues? Went to a custom spring shop in town for work the other day and decided to ask their thoughts on doing it while I was there and those were a couple of the things that they thought would be an issue. Figured this would be a good place to get some answers from people that are running that setup

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Old 08-14-2017, 08:40 PM
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Has anyone experienced any front end sag after running the 4400s for a while or had any driveline/alignment issues? Went to a custom spring shop in town for work the other day and decided to ask their thoughts on doing it while I was there and those were a couple of the things that they thought would be an issue. Figured this would be a good place to get some answers from people that are running that setup

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I got death wobble from having too much caster. Cams can fix that tho. After trimming the bump stops not much else to do.
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Old 08-14-2017, 10:12 PM
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I actually have LESS death wobble now that I lowered it on 4400lb springs with King shocks.

I used to get a bit of wobble on a turning freeway bridge with the expansion joints, it's 100% Gone.

Camber is set at 4.5 IIRC.


I haven't even aligned it since I lowered it. No driveline issues.


For sag, it's dead level with a rear block ******.


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  #38  
Old 08-15-2017, 10:38 PM
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Jomax- can you measure the distance from the center of your wheel hub straight up to the wheel arch in the fender?

I'm 22.25" front and rear. Curious where the 4400# springs measure.
  #39  
Old 08-16-2017, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
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Jomax- can you measure the distance from the center of your wheel hub straight up to the wheel arch in the fender?

I'm 22.25" front and rear. Curious where the 4400# springs measure.

Yup, I'll do it in the AM.


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  #40  
Old 08-17-2017, 08:48 PM
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Yup, I'll do it in the AM.


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you didn't specify which morning...clever
  #41  
Old 08-20-2017, 01:58 PM
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you didn't specify which morning...clever

Lol, sorry. Left that day on a backpacking trip down the Grand Canyon. With all the craziness before the trip. Totally forgot. I'll measure it today.


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  #42  
Old 08-20-2017, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MorganM View Post
Jomax- can you measure the distance from the center of your wheel hub straight up to the wheel arch in the fender?

I'm 22.25" front and rear. Curious where the 4400# springs measure.

I'm at 23 3/4in front and rear


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  #43  
Old 08-21-2017, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
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you didn't specify which morning...clever

Ignoring me now.. lol


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  #44  
Old 08-21-2017, 07:51 PM
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Ha! Thanks.

I expected to be lower, but not by this much. The first springs I tried were .5" lower than these!!

I've had this setup since 2013, and it's a bit rough at times. I think I could go back to stock shackles and 4400 springs to fix the harshness, but I'm not sure about the swaybars. I have hellwig front and back and the back one is for for a 2wd- need to call and verify fitment.

Or sell the truck. Really like new raptor.
  #45  
Old 08-21-2017, 08:07 PM
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Ha! Thanks.

I expected to be lower, but not by this much. The first springs I tried were .5" lower than these!!

I've had this setup since 2013, and it's a bit rough at times. I think I could go back to stock shackles and 4400 springs to fix the harshness, but I'm not sure about the swaybars. I have hellwig front and back and the back one is for for a 2wd- need to call and verify fitment.

Or sell the truck. Really like new raptor.

I'm running a rear swaybar made for a 2wd.

Is your truck 2wd?


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  #46  
Old 08-21-2017, 08:21 PM
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I'm running a rear swaybar made for a 2wd.

Is your truck 2wd?


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No- 4wd. There are signs of the bar rubbing the spare, but I think it only happens when a load is connected.

The 2wd bar will probably work at factory ride height.
  #47  
Old 08-21-2017, 08:22 PM
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No- 4wd. There are signs of the bar rubbing the spare, but I think it only happens when a load is connected.



The 2wd bar will probably work at factory ride height.

How did you get yours so low? I'd go lower if I could. But if probably loose way to much front travel.


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  #48  
Old 08-21-2017, 08:38 PM
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Had springs made by Coil Spring Specialties. The first set were 3" drop with factory rate. Too low.
This set are 2.5" drop at 15% stiffer rate.
  #49  
Old 08-21-2017, 08:46 PM
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Had springs made by Coil Spring Specialties. The first set were 3" drop with factory rate. Too low.
This set are 2.5" drop at 15% stiffer rate.

How much front travel do you have?


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  #50  
Old 08-21-2017, 09:32 PM
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~1.5 - 2". Difficult to measure it, but probably right in the middle- 1.75".

Certainly not enough to air it out over speed bumps!

Last edited by MorganM; 08-21-2017 at 09:38 PM.
  #51  
Old 08-21-2017, 09:58 PM
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~1.5 - 2". Difficult to measure it, but probably right in the middle- 1.75".

Certainly not enough to air it out over speed bumps!

Yeah. I'd die with that little of travel.


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  #52  
Old 10-12-2017, 01:04 PM
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What size u-bolts did y'all use when removing the rear block?

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  #53  
Old 10-12-2017, 08:01 PM
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I ordered new ones, didn’t realize they were the same as the ones on there until I was committed to the removal and the factory ones barely worked. If doing it again I’d get shorter ones.
  #54  
Old 10-13-2017, 01:08 PM
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I got u bolts for a 2wd without overloads from ford.


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  #55  
Old 10-14-2017, 07:47 AM
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I got u bolts for a 2wd without overloads from ford.


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Awesome, thanks. I plan on making the switch pretty soon so wanted to make sure I had everything before I had it torn down and got stuck

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Old 12-25-2017, 05:39 PM
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Well, after lots of questioning I finally got the new suspension put on in time for Christmas! Went with 20x10 wheels with 305/50 Toyo Proxes tires and gotta say I love the way it came out! Thanks to everyone who took time to answer any questions I had and look forward to doing much more to it in the future

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  #57  
Old 12-25-2017, 07:49 PM
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Well, after lots of questioning I finally got the new suspension put on in time for Christmas! Went with 20x10 wheels with 305/50 Toyo Proxes tires and gotta say I love the way it came out! Thanks to everyone who took time to answer any questions I had and look forward to doing much more to it in the future

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Nice! I didnít know toyo still make the original proxes


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  #58  
Old 12-25-2017, 08:07 PM
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Nice! I didnít know toyo still make the original proxes


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Thanks!

Not sure, I have a parts distributor that carries them and they had them in stock so I got them. Don't like the new proxes so was pretty happy they had the originals still

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  #59  
Old 09-24-2020, 03:33 PM
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I'm gonna bring this back up. Sorry if I missed it but has anyone kept the rear stock with 4400# coils in the front? Mine is beginning to sag a hair in the back and I dont wanna take the rear block out because I think that would be too low... im on stock tires rn but my 22x12s and 305x45 420s should be here in a week or so. Thanks
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