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  #1  
Old 12-03-2019, 06:47 PM
romainchu78 romainchu78 is offline
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Default CP4 High pressure pump disaster prevention kit

hello, what is the best quality/price prevention disaster kit on the market for a 2012 f250 6.7L ?
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Old 12-03-2019, 06:52 PM
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Whatever floats your boat. Not really a necessary item imo

Just be careful what you put in the tank.
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Old 12-03-2019, 07:08 PM
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The s&s kit is very nice and well made. I’ve installed several. As Sootie said use good fuel and change filters with motorcraft every time.
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Old 12-03-2019, 07:19 PM
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how many hours did you spent installing it?
are there any cheaper choices than S&S (bit still good quality)?

I buy my diesel fuel from a high traffic Valero gas station. plus i use fuel additive. plus i change my fuel filters twice a year. plus i drain water from tank fuel filter once a month. plus i have a very conservative driving (never any brutal accelerations, try not to exceed 1,500 RPM, do little warm up before driving) but was told the CP4 might still break. my truck has 140,000 miles. i bought it when it had 106,000 miles and i don't know if previous owners took care of it or not. i just can't afford $10,000 in repair for changing the complete fuel system if this happens to break. I would feel more comfortable doing it.
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:19 AM
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Wow you're paranoid.
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:59 AM
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Quote:
try not to exceed 1,500 RPM,

I'd suggest you sell your truck to a real man.....he deserves it more than you.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by romainchu78 View Post
how many hours did you spent installing it?
are there any cheaper choices than S&S (bit still good quality)?

I buy my diesel fuel from a high traffic Valero gas station. plus i use fuel additive. plus i change my fuel filters twice a year. plus i drain water from tank fuel filter once a month. plus i have a very conservative driving (never any brutal accelerations, try not to exceed 1,500 RPM, do little warm up before driving) but was told the CP4 might still break. my truck has 140,000 miles. i bought it when it had 106,000 miles and i don't know if previous owners took care of it or not. i just can't afford $10,000 in repair for changing the complete fuel system if this happens to break. I would feel more comfortable doing it.
Its good to try to take care of stuff, but with that driving style youre doing more harm to the emissions system than you are good to the rest of the truck.
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Old 12-04-2019, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by romainchu78 View Post
how many hours did you spent installing it?
are there any cheaper choices than S&S (bit still good quality)?

I buy my diesel fuel from a high traffic Valero gas station. plus i use fuel additive. plus i change my fuel filters twice a year. plus i drain water from tank fuel filter once a month. plus i have a very conservative driving (never any brutal accelerations, try not to exceed 1,500 RPM, do little warm up before driving) but was told the CP4 might still break. my truck has 140,000 miles. i bought it when it had 106,000 miles and i don't know if previous owners took care of it or not. i just can't afford $10,000 in repair for changing the complete fuel system if this happens to break. I would feel more comfortable doing it.
Its a 6.7l V8, not a C15 Cat, some rpm is definitely not going to hurt it and some hard accelation every so often is a good thing. You're not saving anything by driving it the way you are. If you're that worried, I'd suggest buying a gas engine.
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Last edited by Petro; 12-04-2019 at 07:41 AM.
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Old 12-04-2019, 10:38 AM
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youre doing more harm to the emissions system than you are good to the rest of the truck.
Could you please explain that more in details?
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Old 12-04-2019, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by romainchu78 View Post
Could you please explain that more in details?
Idling, low rpm driving, etc keep heat much lower in the combustion and exhaust level which increases soot loading.
Soot loading contributes to more frequent regens, lower fuel mileage, and shorter emissions equipment life span.
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Old 12-04-2019, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeb View Post
Idling, low rpm driving, etc keep heat much lower in the combustion and exhaust level which increases soot loading.

Soot loading contributes to more frequent regens, lower fuel mileage, and shorter emissions equipment life span.
^
--------------------‐--------------------------------
OP,

I used to be really worried about stuff like that when I got my first PSD. But, think of what they're designed for. They need to been worked at least somewhat. You basically want to do all your maintenance at the correct intervals, remember your payment/don't beat on it from every stop light, but have fun driving it. It likes getting to and maintaining 190-210 oil temp and 1,700-2,000 RPM for extended periods of time. In fact, it needs it, precisely for what Zeb mentioned. Let it run
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:02 PM
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Your best move would be to check and see if your auto insurance covers fuel contamination. Water and subsequent rust is your number one killer of these CP 4 pumps. If they cover it, drive it like you stole it. That chances of you having an issue are pretty slim but I understand your concern. 10k is a large amount of dough to fork over for a repair. Add that in with your monthly truck payment and yeah, it would hurt, bad.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeb View Post
Idling, low rpm driving, etc keep heat much lower in the combustion and exhaust level which increases soot loading.
Soot loading contributes to more frequent regens, lower fuel mileage, and shorter emissions equipment life span.
thanks
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by HeavyAssault View Post
I'd suggest you sell your truck to a real man.....he deserves it more than you.
Real man takes care of their Diesel....
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Old 12-05-2019, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Real man takes care of their Diesel....

Follow my lead then....
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Old 12-10-2019, 09:07 PM
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Id Invest in a diesel site fuel filter kit before a disaster prevention kit.


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Old 12-11-2019, 06:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbodiesel_02 View Post
Id Invest in a diesel site fuel filter kit before a disaster prevention kit.


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Can you explain? I'm not familiar with how it works? Is it a filter that filters right out of the pump? Cause that's the only way to stop metal from entering fuel system...
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Old 12-11-2019, 06:54 AM
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I was understanding the "problem" is fuel lubricity, not filtering.
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Old 12-11-2019, 07:54 AM
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Precisely. And any filtering isn't going to help once a pump is grenading.... People don't get that the fuel used to lube the internals of the pump is directed to the injection cycle of the pump...


Fuel goes in, lubes cam and rollers, picks up metal, then goes directly to the piston to get pressurized and sent to injectors....

Bypass kit takes that lube fuel and tosses it back into tank. It only stops fuel system from being contaminated
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Old 12-11-2019, 08:06 AM
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While I don't have a HPFP to put my hands on I'm asking to gain the knowledge. I'm not trying to argue any particular point.



So the HPFP in stock form uses the same "lube" fuel to inject fuel into the cylinders.
Whereas using the Bypass kit the "lube" fuel is never introduced into the cylinders and has a secondary "clean" feed of fuel to the cylinders.



Is that the right principle of the bypass kit??


So that would leave us to using the OEM filters to capture any shavings/contamination that is "bypassed" to the fuel tank.


Is that correct?
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Old 12-11-2019, 12:15 PM
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Yea but still your pump will fail eventually. If it's sending metal out, it's done. So even after filters catch what's thrown back into tank via the bypass, you've only got a few hundred miles if that before pump grenades.

I'm trying to sell cp3 conversion kits(for DMAX) and FASS systems to customers with good running trucks. That's $5k spent there is alot better than the $11k they'll spend after the pump fails and contaminates the system
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Old 12-11-2019, 12:33 PM
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Yea. I found the newer S&S video that gave some internal understanding to the "how it works" of the HPFP. I gathered the biggest point was not that the roller bearing of itself causes the problem, but a two fold event that requires the guide to turn 90* to the cam which causes the roller bearing to now be in a "not as designed" orientation. That is when the most severe HPFP failure issue can occur and happen where the bearing is eaten up by the cam.


I want to say the video gives credence to the air that becomes entrapped in fuel as the possible/principle source of creating the environment to cause the guide to rotate 90*.


I'm not trying to say one way or the other how these failures happen. Just giving info that I gathered from the video.


So with the combined factors of air entrapment and poor fuel lubricity these are key elements of the HPFP failures plaguing the industry. Yes, one can cause the issue just as much as the other, but both issues combined cause a huge issue to rise up much faster.



Does that sound about right?


I would never disagree adding filters, additional water removal, supporting pumps, and air removal are quite effective "insurance" to helping our fuel systems.
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Old 12-12-2019, 09:49 AM
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Could always upgrade to the Exergy improves stock CP4 pump or Exergy inlet metering valve depends what you want to spend.


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Old 02-24-2020, 12:20 PM
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I have a 2011 with 160k and a 2014 with 170k. I have been adding Wal-Mart 2 stroke oil in 85% of my fill ups since new. (Actually starting at 40k on the 11). 1/2 gallon on the 32 gallon tank (14) and 1/3 gallon on the 11 with the small tank 23 gallon or so. No fuel system or *** issues as of yet!
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Old 02-24-2020, 12:36 PM
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Cool. But that doesn't help with air or starvation if your lift pump was to go out.
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Old 02-24-2020, 08:47 PM
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From a beloved cp4 today on a Duramelt with 175k. Guy said he got a fuel filter warning, then it just shut down on him. He said he drained some water out of the filter afterwards, and then replaced the filter. Lol.
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Old 02-25-2020, 05:36 AM
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Just drive it... I've seen where some people take exceptional care of a vehicle and it has many issues. Then I've seen a rancher who doesn't change oil for years much less fuel filters and it never stops running.

Yes preventative maintenance will help in most cases but in some instances things just fail, no matter how well they're taken care of. Take your chances and do what you feel is right.

IMO like most have already said put good fuel, drain water and drive it. Or you could always go buy a new one with a warranty.
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Old 02-25-2020, 06:47 AM
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From a beloved cp4 today on a Duramelt with 175k. Guy said he got a fuel filter warning, then it just shut down on him. He said he drained some water out of the filter afterwards, and then replaced the filter. Lol.
Oh man I love seeing that. Money in the bank!
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Old 02-25-2020, 10:34 AM
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Two stroke oil in a cr lol
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Old 02-27-2020, 06:28 PM
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Oh man I love seeing that. Money in the bank!
Not quite. I work for a heavy equipment dealer as a field mechanic. This is a customer of ours and I was asked to go diagnose when they broke down on the highway. They towed it to a local G.M. dealer.
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Old 02-28-2020, 12:25 PM
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Well what the ****? Give them your number and do it on the side.
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Old 02-29-2020, 04:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigdogdiesel View Post
I have a 2011 with 160k and a 2014 with 170k. I have been adding Wal-Mart 2 stroke oil in 85% of my fill ups since new. (Actually starting at 40k on the 11). 1/2 gallon on the 32 gallon tank (14) and 1/3 gallon on the 11 with the small tank 23 gallon or so. No fuel system or *** issues as of yet!



You are adding WAY to much oil. I did my own "fuel additive" research....2 stoke sucks in a 6.7L...especially when you track MPGs.


There's other ways to add lubricity to the fuel.
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Old 02-29-2020, 09:37 PM
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Well what the ****? Give them your number and do it on the side.
They make some questionable decisions sometimes lol. It really was a courtesy thing. I thought about it, but don't have the space to do so in an apartment with very limited parking. Once I have a house it'll be a different story.
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Old 03-08-2020, 05:13 AM
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So I use Valero mainly, teat my fuel, and Ford has maintained the truck from day one. 2015 F250 108k on the odometer and my CP4 is finished. I did not know about the issues with the CP4 and ford warranty acted like they would cover it according to the service writer. They found rust a and said not.going to happen. I had the trucked towed to the house because I am.all but done with Ford. Called my insurance company and they sent my fuel off twice with different samples and both times no water was found in the fuel. So truck will sit till I take it to PSE in houston for repairs. Truck has never been abused and always serviced so I guess **** happens.

That being said the disaster kit will be installed on the truck as well.

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Old 03-08-2020, 07:00 AM
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Yup. Just quoted out another on Friday. $10,500...


I have a feeling I'm going to own more 6.7 trucks than I have 6.0s due to customer no fixes. In a few years nobody's going to be fixing 2013 trucks
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Old 03-08-2020, 07:55 AM
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So if one were so inclined to just swap out the HPFP before the issues started, how much would you charge for that work??
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Old 03-08-2020, 10:07 AM
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Isn't book hour like 6 hours?

If I had one of these piles I'd install a new pump, the bypass kit, and also a fass fuel system. The air that can come from these stock lift pumps is horrific. We clear lined the feed after the lift pump and every time you key on it gets a surge of air. Also with the dozens of failures I've seen, only a few had apparent signs6of contamination. Rest had clean fuel, I mean they may have ran low or gelled, but usually you can't tell. So that leads me to believe it's air. Both from services and the natural air the pump produces on start up.
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Old 03-08-2020, 02:03 PM
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That's an interesting thought there. I agree with the FASS as well the stock water separator is junk. I never changed anything in case I needed to use that expensive warranty. After this I see how I will be treated by Ford I am over it.

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Old 03-08-2020, 02:22 PM
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Ford knows what their doing. They did it with the 6.4 and their doing it with the 6.7.
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Old 03-09-2020, 06:09 AM
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I've been wanting to do some fuel system mods. Just not ready to go at it right now. I have long considered adding on a sump, pusher pump (AirDog, FASS), then swap in a new HPFP.



Currently using a DieselSite filter kit.
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Old 03-09-2020, 05:04 PM
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I wonder how long it actually takes for the problem to become visible, to start exhibiting symptoms and show signs of rusting. Tanks are being checked for fuel contamination but I'm wondering if by the time the truck is having a problem, has the bad tank of fuel already been consumed and refilled at another station? If so, bad fuel would likely be the cause of the problem even if the fuel samples test clean. And also likely the reason that Ford is ignoring clean fuel tests. They probably know the damage was done before the current fuel was ever put in the tank.
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Old 03-09-2020, 07:01 PM
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You know I thought about that to. However when you think out it how long does that rust take to get there. Where is the oxygen coming from to create rust. So most likely wont be in that tank my thoughts.

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Old 03-11-2020, 06:38 AM
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I'm pretty sure one of the guys on here pulled the vcv or whatever is on the rail on a brand new truck and there was rust on it. I could be wrong though as it was awhile a go.
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Old 03-11-2020, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonnydime View Post
I'm pretty sure one of the guys on here pulled the vcv or whatever is on the rail on a brand new truck and there was rust on it. I could be wrong though as it was awhile a go.
Yep. Duston did back in 2013 or thereabouts
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Old 03-11-2020, 06:05 PM
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Thats ford for you they probably install them that way. Hate to be that way, but this situation is bs

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Old 03-22-2020, 12:29 PM
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Definitely not trying to derail OP's topic, but any thoughts on use of the Exergy CP4.2 Inlet Metering Valve? Found it browsing the web and crosschecked it on a couple vendors for availability, averaging $240.00. Apparently the valve is updated with 25 micron rating, double filter screens (OEM single 80 micron screen), which if a CP4 does fail - the valve will collect debris and prevent fueling the engine/shutting it down.

Wondering if this may be a better option for CP4 failures, considering cost and labor involved with the SS Prevention Kit? Still learning my 6.7, since leaving the 6.0 last summer.
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Old 03-22-2020, 02:57 PM
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Honestly with what I am going through I am looking at both. Would love to put an inline filter between CP4 and fuel rail tip injectors, or one OB the discharge from the bypass kit to collect metal

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