Alternators kill 6.0s?

Lassie · Nov 20, 2012

I've had two issues with my truck over the years that had to do with missing or rough idle...Both started after alternator issues. The first time, years ago, my battery light had come on a week or so earlier. The batts checked good, so I kept driving. When the alternator finally stopped charging, the truck bucked and jerked badly and shut down. I replaced the alternator on the side of the road and the truck started with a terrible miss....Ended up with #4 and #6 contribution/balance codes. I changed the driver side bank of injectors and cured the miss.

This month, i was on an out of state hunting trip, and the battery light came on again. I was able to monitor with autoenginuity and the batteries were holding but alternator not charging. I didn't make it off the hunting property before the bucking started and I shut her down. Had a family member bring an alternator and jump me. Truck started and ran perfect for one minute....then the idle got rough and I've had a cyl cont/balance code on #1 ever since.

I've read alot about low voltage killing FICMs, but in neither of these cases have I had FICM problems. I did have to resolder my FICM board in the past due to a code and low voltage, but not near an alternator/battery problem.

Maybe it's just a coincidence, but it seems to me loosing an alt kills injectors. Just wondering if anyone else lost injectors due to batt/alternator issues?

Atsah · Nov 20, 2012

6.0's and low voltage don't get along very well..

Jeremyleggett07 · Nov 20, 2012

Low voltage can cause the FICM to slowly die and FICM may not throw proper voltage to the injectors and will cause contribution codes. Need to check FICM voltage with meter key on-engine off, then while cranking, then key on engine on.

Zmann · Nov 20, 2012

yup

that is why I monitor voltage
and run a large case DCpower alternator

Lassie · Nov 20, 2012

I'm starting to think the alternator needs to be a 2 year scheduled maintenance item on this truck...this also happenned both times after or during long road trips. These alternators get hot enough to fry eggs too

Lassie · Nov 20, 2012

I've done that with AE and it hasnt dropped below 47...Does AE not catch the droop sometimes?

Zmann · Nov 20, 2012

Heat is why the older large case is a good upgrade .. more breathing room

Jeremyleggett07 · Nov 20, 2012

DC Tad-190 works great with my red top optimas

Snake · Nov 20, 2012

I call the 6.0 a domino motor: when one part fails, it often takes out the next in line. In this case, the alternator goes bad, takes out one or both batteries, then the FICM, then at least one injector. If the truck gets to the point where the motor has died, its very probable that your FICM wasn't seeing enough voltage and caused an injector to fail.

Are you monitoring battery voltage and FICM voltage all the time, or just with the AE when there's a problem?

As mentioned, the alternators on these trucks can be a recurring problem. I replaced my OEM with an aftermarket unit, but that aftermarket alternator failed in just over 2 years. I went with a different aftermarket company, and that alternator was bad right out of the box. I finally put on my big boy pants and bought an alternator from DC Power.

Lassie · Nov 20, 2012

I only monitor batt voltage occasionally, but I regularly watch FICM logic or whatever its called. I've never seen any drop below 47 V, KOEO, starting, or running but AE could be missing it. The FICM is probably weaker even if voltage is normal range....I'll probably have to pick up a halfshell before I do the injector now, just to ease my mind:fustrate:

Lassie · Nov 26, 2012

Update...I ordered a FICM halfshell before thanksgiving but it wont be in until today. I drove truck to work Friday and at lunch, the truck lost all pedal response and I had to pull over. It idled terribly and had so little power that it wouldnt hardly move itself. I limped the truck to a fuel station because the fuel level was at one quarter and it acted as if to have no fuel. After filling, the truck started fine and I took it home.

I started again the next morning and after one minute or less, the idle got really rough again, so I shut it off and got AE out. No cylinders in the passenger side bank were contributing. Tested FICM again and finally saw a drop to 45 V at KOEO. I also pulled the secondary fuel filter and FICM and pump fuses and did the bubble test....no bubbles.

This sounds like it could be a FICM for sure, which I'd love because International says mine will be here today, but after I looked at the schematics....FICM cables power 1,4,6,7 and 2,3,5,8. I'm loosing the whole odd bank. Does this sound like a typical FICM failure someone has seen? Loosing contribution on a whole bank at once?

CCRICE · Nov 26, 2012

From my understanding one connector is for ficm power, and the other two control their respective banks. So if I'm correct I would say yes.

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Lassie · Nov 27, 2012

It looks like the FICM is wired for two cylinders on each bank per connector.

I changed the FICM half shell and installed two new batts last night. FICM Volts stayed at 47 and the truck started idling rough after about 20 seconds again. Cylinders 1,3, and 5 looked like they weren't in the game on the power balance. I guess I'm going into the head. I've got one new injector and Alliant Power o'ring kits with high pressure seals for the other three injectors. If I can't see an obvious issue with an oring or the HP oil rail, I will change #1 to see if it at least improves that cylinder. Then, I'll at least know what to buy to fix the rest.

Also, while I had the degas bottle bolts out and had the bottle pushed to the side, I broke the T fitting under the bottle. :fustrate: Turns out that fitting comes as a part of the radiator hose. Part number 3C3Z8075AE in case anyone ever needs it. This fix is getting expensive quick.

Lassie · Dec 3, 2012

Another update....Got the radiator hose Friday, so I went in to it this weekend. Updated the blue fuel spring, fuel line bolts/washers, pulled out the EGR throttle plate, and changed the #8 glow plug. Had to destroy the harness to unplug #8!

Anyway, I went into the head expecting to change #1 injector, since that was the last cont/bal code I got. AE had shown recently that #1,#3, and #5 werent contributing on the power balance graph, but #1 was the only one showing codes, so I was going to change it. I pulled #1, #3, and #5. #5 was burnt from the end to the first oring. The oring had already failed. The injector hold down was not even snug. NOT what I expected. I changed #5 instead and refreshed the orings on #1 and 3. I put it all back together and am waiting to get a new glow plug harness to try it out.

One thing that bothers me is the injector cup. It was dirty inside and the copper washer was nowhere to be found! I cleaned out the cup as good as I could and the washer is definitely gone. I'm assuming the copper washer was burned up. Anyone else seen this?

FallenAuthority · Dec 3, 2012

Lassie said:
Another update....Got the radiator hose Friday, so I went in to it this weekend. Updated the blue fuel spring, fuel line bolts/washers, pulled out the EGR throttle plate, and changed the #8 glow plug. Had to destroy the harness to unplug #8!

Anyway, I went into the head expecting to change #1 injector, since that was the last cont/bal code I got. AE had shown recently that #1,#3, and #5 werent contributing on the power balance graph, but #1 was the only one showing codes, so I was going to change it. I pulled #1, #3, and #5. #5 was burnt from the end to the first oring. The oring had already failed. The injector hold down was not even snug. NOT what I expected. I changed #5 instead and refreshed the orings on #1 and 3. I put it all back together and am waiting to get a new glow plug harness to try it out.

One thing that bothers me is the injector cup. It was dirty inside and the copper washer was nowhere to be found! I cleaned out the cup as good as I could and the washer is definitely gone. I'm assuming the copper washer was burned up. Anyone else seen this?

Yes I see it at work all the time, loose injector hold down, burns up copper ring, blows combustion gas up into fuel causing the rest of the injectors on that bank to start missing as well. I have had pretty good luck so far with using an injector brush to clean the injector cups really well before reassembling with new orings and copper washer, but I have a few co-workers who have not and have had to put injector cups in.
Pick up an injector brush and try cleaning #5 REALLY well and hope for the best. MAKE SURE TO TORQUE HOLD DOWNS PROPERLY!

Lassie · Dec 4, 2012

I cleaned the cup as good as I could, Q-tipped out the injector hold down holes, and installed the injectors. I fired it up and at least I'm back where I started. The truck is running pretty smooth, but #1 still needs replaced. Constant cont/bal code on it and AE power balance still shows it is weak.

I've got to go back for #1 and now I'm worried about the cup for #5. I didn't use anything abrasive in the cup when I cleaned it. Are the brushes used to clean it steel or brass? Or would a bottle brush work? Do you use solvents?

I just used oil and rags to wipe out the cup as far as I could get down in it. And can #5 cup even be replaced in the engine? It's a bear to get to to just change the injector.

FallenAuthority · Dec 4, 2012

I use steel injector brushes with some trans fluid on them to help clean it up.
I dont believe the cup for #5 can be replaced in cab, I havent done one on that cylinder so I cant say for sure.

Extended Power · Dec 5, 2012

I put a smaller pulley on my alternator about 2 years ago...got maybe 10,000 kms on the setup...replaced the alternator today with a Mean Green 200 amp.

I think the 4000 rpm of the engine, x 3= ~ 12000 rpm on the alternator.
The smaller pulley might work for engine that idle a lot....but not rev a lot...

Zmann · Dec 5, 2012

My DC power came with a smaller pulley
and a spacer for under the mounts if u used it

been fine for over 2 years so far

Extended Power · Dec 5, 2012

Zmann said:
My DC power came with a smaller pulley
and a spacer for under the mounts if u used it

been fine for over 2 years so far

I don't think installing the smaller pulley on the stock alternator helped anything but kill it faster.
I'm sure alternators that are built better won't have issues with the smaller pulleys.