Comp Beehive Spring questions

[brewer]

I'm considering using some beehives for my motor build (250/2s, eventually t4 turbo setup, studs, smith bros pushrods). I have the springs now, from a friend that didn't end up using them.
I have all 4 of the part numbers (springs, locators, retainers, and locks) that people have used, but information seems to be a bit scattered in threads about the locators and valve stems seals.

My question is - what is story on using the comp locators vs stock? What valve stem seals are needed for using the comp cams locators?

Also-curious about what I've heard about valve seat wear with these. My truck isnt a daily driver, but I still use it on weekends for trips, camping, fishing, hauling, and a bit of towing, etc. I probably put about 8k miles a year on the truck. Are these beehives too aggressive for my uses?

 

[brewer]

Bump

 

[brewer]

Looking to figure this out asap since I'm tearing the truck apart this weekend to start this project.

Here's the part numbers I've pulled off other threads.

Are guys using the Comp Locators (valve spring seats) and/or different valve stem seals or just the stock ones?

Comp Springs #26120-16
Comp Locators #4696-16
Comp Retainers #795-16
Comp Locks #617-16

 

[gnxtc2]

I think you need to use a Chevy style seal. I wanted to use beehives but couldn't find info them, it's like a big secret.

Billy T.
[email protected]

 

[brewer]

Thanks Billy, I guess I'm not going crazy that this is the missing link on info about these. The info on them is all over the place and I never found one confirmation on these two parts from someone that had installed them. But I did read that about the small block chevy seals. Hopefully someone may chime in here but I may have to try contacting an engine builder or something.

 

[Ron's Power Stroke]

i have a set of beehives installed on my motor..motor has not been run yet..i used stock seals with beehive springs, retainers, and locks....no shims..
did you see this thread??
http://powerstrokearmy.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45156

 

[brewer]

Good to know, thank you. I did see that one, and frankly it was a bit unorganized and there were no real definite answers to my questions. So thank you, that answer helps.

 

[Ron's Power Stroke]

i hear that....you should run aftermarket push rods too..these springs are stiff...you want a install height of 1.880 using the beehive retainers, and locks

.OD: Top 1.095" Bottom 1.445"
ID: Top .650" Bottom 1.000"
Seat Pressure: 155 lbs @ 1.880''
Open Pressure: 377 lbs @ 1.280''
Coil Bind: 1.230"
Spring Rate: 370 lbs/in

 

[brewer]

Yea I have a set of smith bros push rods to go in too. I have heard about excessive valve seat wear with the beehives, should I be concerned about that @ 155 lbs?

 

[Ron's Power Stroke]

i hear the same thing and it makes sense..never could find an answer for how excessive..

 

[FrankTheTank]

I think irate will sell you everything needed to run beehives.

 

[brewer]

Was able to figure out what all is needed, looks like its stock seats(with the built in seals, of course). It sounds like the comp locators that I listed above can be used, but other valve seals must be used (some kind of chevy small block or others; DI, Swamps, Irate would probably be the best source of this). I may still contact them in the next few days. Im also in the process of finding out about this "excessive" valve wear. Im not unfamiliar with how valve seat wear works but just want to find out what really is considered excessive as Ron mentioned. Hopefully we'll get all the rest of the beehive info that isnt readily available in existing threads into this one for others' future reference.

 

[elrodalexander73]

The stock rotators are supposed to turn the valve like 2.5 degrees every time it moves up and down to help keep the sealing surface true, this was designed to help stop hot spots on the valve as it was placed under heavy load conditions... I kinda wondered the same thing myself, how does the valve not wear into the seat quickly without being able to rotate...

 

[brewer]

Well I'm finally getting around to giving an update.

After talking to a couple engine builders, I decided to go with the 155lb Beehives. Upon asking about the "advanced" valve seat wear, I was told that it's more across the "expected" life of the motor. E.g., if you compare 2 motors with ~300k miles, one being stock and the other with beehives/performance pushrods/larger injectors, the latter would have the increased wear.
For my use, this seemed reasonable, and frankly, as we all know, with a performance setup, these kind of things are somewhat expected.

I have put about 3k miles on my build so far (250/2s, 38r, pushrods, studs, IC, etc.), and have been enjoying it greatly.

I'm currently working through trying different tuning and will be upgrading soon to the reasonably new DP F6 v2 that's open source. I'll be running tuning from different tuners on the chip and looking forward to not having to keep pulling my chip out ointlaugh:. Yes, I could get a Hydra, but I really like the DP operation, including the ease of popping it in and out of no-start when I feel like it or when I'm not driving the truck for an extended period of time.

The 38r has been a bit of a challenge to tune with the 200%'s, but my plans are for compounds down the road, so for now I'm planning on staying with these sticks.