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Message: [QUOTE="TARM, post: 308733, member: 578"] Yes we did. I will find it for us and link it here. 07 PS, If this is a bit off on typing and spelling I apologize as I am on my phone. There advantages and disadvantages between both setups. It has more to do with what your planned uses are more than anything. Honestly in looking at some of the criticism of Trevor's systems over on PSN way back before he became a vendor were actually quite amusing. (TT, Not talking about our threads discussions) It was painfully obvious how little many people understand how various traction's bars work and what exactly they are meant to stop. First you have the triangulated bar which we can just call a 3 point bar. Then wee have a single pole or 2 point bar. With a 3 point you have the two points at the top and bottom of the axle tube. The farther the separation between the two points the more effective and stronger the setup. Of the two the lower the bottom point the stronger as it creates more counter leverage force opposing the axles attempted upward rotation. With a 3 point system you need a shackled front point because the two points on the axle lock it in place and greatly limits any independent rotation as the axle cycles. This is handled by the shackle at the front very much as with a leaf spring. It handles the differences in arc of travel of the leaf spring vs the bar. This gives you the added strength of the triangle with 2 mount points on the axle tube as well as with shackle gives it as much adjustment for differences in travel as possible. I will not get into the effects of the systems to deal with squat and antisquat and how it has to do with traction and suspension force and effects of moving the front mounting points. So the front shackle when properly setup can allow for even the longest travel spring packs to fully cycle up and down. But there is also a weakness to this when you are using two of these ladder type bars. Because of the 2 points of mount at the axle it is locking in any lateral differences in travel otherwise called articulation. One wheel up fully compressing the suspension and one down fully extending it. With two of these ladder bars you are effectively turning the entire axle and bars into one big antisway bar as far as articulation goes. Think of how the two look they are very similar. On the street and for track use towing etc this can be a very good thing. It can actually improve handling. But if you were to have springs that flex and travel well and you were off road or did anything that put each wheel at oppsite ends of the suspension travel you can get binding just as you would with a sway bar. Infact this is why offroad setups remove them or have disconnects for them. In the case of a dual ladder traction bars it will either hold the one wheel from traveling or they will bend or joints break if they are not strong enough. The force applied to a ladder type traction bar with a shackle is only directly upward when the axle tries to rotate upward which causes the leaf springs to wrap into a S shape. Many think the forces on the front of this type of traction bar are also forward and rearward but they are only up and down. Unless they go to the point of binding from to much articulation. Something that will never happen on the street track strip but only is hard use off road Now the 2 point or straight bar can not have a shackle on the front as it only ties into the axle at one point. That point must be below the center line of the axle and the farther below the better ground clearance permitting. With these the longer the bar the better as far as travel goes as well as the ability to have it increase traction under force. The issues are mainly in setting up and in strength. Now you have all force going to one single bar and only the one axle point. As the bar has not means of increasing or decreasing its positions forward or rearward it must be setup properly to not cause binding if there is extreme travel of the axle. The benefit over the ladder type is because it only has the one joint on the axle it will allow the axle to articulate better and will not bind until much farther extreme angles are reached. The biggest thing is strength. Remember the force on the bar is of the axle pushing up on the bar this basically putting force upward on the joint and the bar itself. The more power traction and force the stronger the bar needs to be hence Trevor's general chart to help people figure it out. The main time you will get force that break mounts etc would be in a binding situation such as the bars path of travel is differing than that of the leaf springs in relation to the axles path. Again the longer the bar the better for single bars as a general rule without going to stupid lengths. But the longer the bar the stronger it needs to be to resist bending and or gussets welded in to increase rigidity and strength. Now there are some things as far as joint types go that can minimize some of the weaknesses of each but they are basically fundamental to the type of bar you are running. I am a form follows function kind of person so if it works better for my task I am going to pick it over one that looks cooler or badass etc.. I will take that little bit of extra perf. [/QUOTE]