anyone care to "dumb down" the 5r shift pattern for me?

[slc6oh]

been reading and reading and reading and still about clear as mud on the way the 5r works...

truck was due for a trans service so I jus did new fluid&filter (ford lv oil and ford tp roll filter) and empire direct clutch solenoid. ( cause the internet says its a good idea for an extra piece of mind... so it must be right? hahah )

so what ive gathered.,

@ temps above 0degrees f. the trans shifts 1,2,3,5,6
and below 0 will shift into 4th.

but heres where im lost..
on my cts2. it always shows 1 2 3 4 5, as im going up through the gears.

so is it reading 1 2 3 5 6 and just calling it 1 2 3 4 5 ?
my ID extreme street tune does not lock until 5th (or is it 6th? even though the edge says 5th)
will I actually see a 6 on my edge in the rare case that im driving with oil below 0deg f?

anyone smarter than myself care to help me understand?

thanks guys.
:fordoval::fordoval::fordoval::fordoval::fordoval::fordoval:

 

[drunk on diesel]

4th is limp gear...

the engineers who designed the transmission say it's a 6 speed where 4th is limp, and they would say it shifts 1, 2, 3, 5, 6

The rest of the world says hey, when I'm driving down the road, it goes through 5 gears... so let's call them 1, 2, 3, 4, 5

and let's call the limp gear limp or alternate 4th

it's semantics/splitting hairs

 

[slc6oh]

4th is limp gear...

the engineers who designed the transmission say it's a 6 speed where 4th is limp, and they would say it shifts 1, 2, 3, 5, 6

The rest of the world says hey, when I'm driving down the road, it goes through 5 gears... so let's call them 1, 2, 3, 4, 5

and let's call the limp gear limp or alternate 4th

it's semantics/splitting hairs

kinda what im assuming. thanks!

so the DC solenoid is upping oil volume on 4-5 shift correct? (I keep reading its the 3-5 shift)

 

[drunk on diesel]

the "3-5" shift would be the "3-4" shift when you're sitting in the seat

 

[Lipka101]

What drunk said. Pretty much just forget about the whole 1-2-3-5-6 shift pattern if you have the edge. It will be 1-2-3-4-5. And yes IDP tunes don't lock until 5th unless you're at wot.

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[Rubenk]

Yep, tuner/monitor programmers dont care about the engineering technicalities of what gear is what, so it just goes 1-5th, usually says "alt 4" or something like that when, if ever, it uses the alternate shift pattern.

Keep in mind some people mistake TC lock for a shift, as it can feel that way alot of times.

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

There is no "limp gear." Someone just made that up.

The 5R110 is really two transmissions in one case. There is a two speed in front, with a 1:1 ratio and an overdrive 0.71:1 ratio. Behind that is a three speed with 3.1:1, 1.54:1, and 1:1 ratios.

Here's how it shifts:
First gear is both units in low, 1:1 times 3.1:1 = 3.1:1 overall ratio.
Second is the front in overdrive, the rear didn't change, so 0.71:1 times 3.1:1 = 2.2:1 second gear ratio.
Third gear is the front back in 1:1 and the rear shifts to 1.54:1, so 1:1 times 1.54:1 = 1.54:1 third gear.
I'm going to skip four for a moment.
Fifth gear is normally the next gear in the pattern. This has both units at 1:1, so that's fifth gear ratio.
Sixth gear is the front unit back in overdrive, so 0.71:1 times 1:1 = the overdrive ratio of 0.71:1.

Fourth gear was never intended to be used. It is the front in overdrive and the rear in 1.54:1 ratio, so 0.71:1 times 1.54:1 = 1.09:1 ratio. This is so close to 1:1 that it doesn't make sense to use it in the normal pattern.

When the trans is warmer than 0F it shifts 1-2-3-4-6. Some aftermarket programmers chose to make their units read 5 when they know very well the trans software calls it 6. Maybe they thought their customers were not smart enough to realize this? I don't know.

During the development of the 5R110W we found that the 3-5 shift was nearly impossible to complete when the trans was colder than 0F. We could to the 3-4, and then the 4-6 with no problems, but for reasons I won't go into here the 3-5 was nearly impossible. So we changed the shift pattern when colder than 0F to shift 1-2-3-4-6.

Later on we realized the there is a small window of speed where if you are in sixth gear and floor the go pedal you're just a bit too fast to drop back to third gear, but fifth gear doesn't quite get the acceleration that you want. In this case it actually shifts to fourth gear instead of fifth gear. This gives 9% more torque to the wheels. From fourth gear it can only shift to sixth gear or to third gear. It will NEVER shift 4-5 or 5-4.

And that's my perspective from being a calibration engineer that actually developed the Ford program that runs this transmission.

 

[Jomax]

There is no "limp gear." Someone just made that up.

The 5R110 is really two transmissions in one case. There is a two speed in front, with a 1:1 ratio and an overdrive 0.71:1 ratio. Behind that is a three speed with 3.1:1, 1.54:1, and 1:1 ratios.

Here's how it shifts:
First gear is both units in low, 1:1 times 3.1:1 = 3.1:1 overall ratio.
Second is the front in overdrive, the rear didn't change, so 0.71:1 times 3.1:1 = 2.2:1 second gear ratio.
Third gear is the front back in 1:1 and the rear shifts to 1.54:1, so 1:1 times 1.54:1 = 1.54:1 third gear.
I'm going to skip four for a moment.
Fifth gear is normally the next gear in the pattern. This has both units at 1:1, so that's fifth gear ratio.
Sixth gear is the front unit back in overdrive, so 0.71:1 times 1:1 = the overdrive ratio of 0.71:1.

Fourth gear was never intended to be used. It is the front in overdrive and the rear in 1.54:1 ratio, so 0.71:1 times 1.54:1 = 1.09:1 ratio. This is so close to 1:1 that it doesn't make sense to use it in the normal pattern.

When the trans is warmer than 0F it shifts 1-2-3-4-6. Some aftermarket programmers chose to make their units read 5 when they know very well the trans software calls it 6. Maybe they thought their customers were not smart enough to realize this? I don't know.

During the development of the 5R110W we found that the 3-5 shift was nearly impossible to complete when the trans was colder than 0F. We could to the 3-4, and then the 4-6 with no problems, but for reasons I won't go into here the 3-5 was nearly impossible. So we changed the shift pattern when colder than 0F to shift 1-2-3-4-6.

Later on we realized the there is a small window of speed where if you are in sixth gear and floor the go pedal you're just a bit too fast to drop back to third gear, but fifth gear doesn't quite get the acceleration that you want. In this case it actually shifts to fourth gear instead of fifth gear. This gives 9% more torque to the wheels. From fourth gear it can only shift to sixth gear or to third gear. It will NEVER shift 4-5 or 5-4.

And that's my perspective from being a calibration engineer that actually developed the Ford program that runs this transmission.

Always enjoy reading your posts!


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[sootie]

There may be no "limp" gear but mine sure as he'll went to the alternate 4th when it thought there was a problem...

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

If it sees a problem with direct drive (5th gear) it will use fourth gear instead.

 

[Powerstroke Man 6.4]

There is no "limp gear." Someone just made that up.

The 5R110 is really two transmissions in one case. There is a two speed in front, with a 1:1 ratio and an overdrive 0.71:1 ratio. Behind that is a three speed with 3.1:1, 1.54:1, and 1:1 ratios.

Here's how it shifts:
First gear is both units in low, 1:1 times 3.1:1 = 3.1:1 overall ratio.
Second is the front in overdrive, the rear didn't change, so 0.71:1 times 3.1:1 = 2.2:1 second gear ratio.
Third gear is the front back in 1:1 and the rear shifts to 1.54:1, so 1:1 times 1.54:1 = 1.54:1 third gear.
I'm going to skip four for a moment.
Fifth gear is normally the next gear in the pattern. This has both units at 1:1, so that's fifth gear ratio.
Sixth gear is the front unit back in overdrive, so 0.71:1 times 1:1 = the overdrive ratio of 0.71:1.

Fourth gear was never intended to be used. It is the front in overdrive and the rear in 1.54:1 ratio, so 0.71:1 times 1.54:1 = 1.09:1 ratio. This is so close to 1:1 that it doesn't make sense to use it in the normal pattern.

When the trans is warmer than 0F it shifts 1-2-3-4-6. Some aftermarket programmers chose to make their units read 5 when they know very well the trans software calls it 6. Maybe they thought their customers were not smart enough to realize this? I don't know.

During the development of the 5R110W we found that the 3-5 shift was nearly impossible to complete when the trans was colder than 0F. We could to the 3-4, and then the 4-6 with no problems, but for reasons I won't go into here the 3-5 was nearly impossible. So we changed the shift pattern when colder than 0F to shift 1-2-3-4-6.

Later on we realized the there is a small window of speed where if you are in sixth gear and floor the go pedal you're just a bit too fast to drop back to third gear, but fifth gear doesn't quite get the acceleration that you want. In this case it actually shifts to fourth gear instead of fifth gear. This gives 9% more torque to the wheels. From fourth gear it can only shift to sixth gear or to third gear. It will NEVER shift 4-5 or 5-4.

And that's my perspective from being a calibration engineer that actually developed the Ford program that runs this transmission.

Awesome read, Thanks for the info.

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

When the trans is warmer than 0F it shifts 1-2-3-4-6.

I just noticed this typo. It should have read 1-2-3-5-6.