A couple of Electric Fuel System questions

Tom S

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I am not sure that you need to do that for the different micron filters. It might have to do with proprietary filters. I wanted cat filters for a matching look. There should not be an issue with a link to someplace when it fits in with the discussion. It is way different when someone posts a link to a non-sponsor that competes with paying sponsors.



I think you would be most likely OK without the heater. Plenty of truck have the one in the valley disabled. Even in cold weather the fuel in the tank does start to get warm with with run time as the fuel comes back into the tank from the hot motor. You will have to decide if you want that extra insurance. That heater is only going to add a small amount of warmth though when it is only say a 150 watt heater. Think of a light bulb.

Lastly I do not think you to go too fine on the pre-filter. The purpose of that filter is to remove water and protect your pump. The final filter is to protect the injectors.
 
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Tom S

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If you find the stuff on Napa's site it would be nice to post up some part numbers or links or something. I do not have that stuff saved.
 

StrokerTurbo7.3

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If you find the stuff on Napa's site it would be nice to post up some part numbers or links or something. I do not have that stuff saved.

:whs: it would be nice when it comes time to change mine out.

On the fuel heater debate, mine gelled up one time with my fuel system I have now. It was for sure 0*+ whatever the wind chill was. I didn't have any fuel additives in it. After that happened I made sure to have some mixed in and I never had a problem once after that.
 

superduty4x4

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:whs: it would be nice when it comes time to change mine out.

On the fuel heater debate, mine gelled up one time with my fuel system I have now. It was for sure 0*+ whatever the wind chill was. I didn't have any fuel additives in it. After that happened I made sure to have some mixed in and I never had a problem once after that.
I gelled once last fall on a 20° day, after I had driven the truck to work already... still baffles me. Stock OBS fuel system.
Anywho I think I'll forget about the heater for now, that saves $50 and makes this build even more affordable. For future reference, here is the link for Discount Fleet Supply. The Wix part number I found for a 10 micron prefilter is 33680, Napa part number 3680. It fits the Stanadyne Fuel Manager filter head and specs out for JD telescopic handlers. A little trick I've learned from doing this fuel system build research- take any Wix part number and drop the first number, type it in at Napa's web site and it will very likely pop up. All the parts I've found at DFS I was also able to cross reference to Napa. I found some of the Wix part numbers at Fleet filter and used those numbers at DFS to find things as well.
Tom you made reference to not going too fine on the prefilter, I've been looking for a 10 micron because it seems that's what most use. If you have a good recommendation as to why that may be too fine I'd like to hear it.
 
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superduty4x4

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FWIW, the customer support guy I spoke with at DFS says that the 33680 filter I found will NOT fit the 24911 fuel manager filter base, even though their site states that the 33680 filter is for the fuel manager filter bases. I might see if the local Napa has both on hand and can verify this for me, it may be as simple as modifying the filter base like Tom did to get the filter to fit.
 

Tom S

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Do not be afraid of modding that base. It really was easy to do with the dremel. I think I also have saved a filter cross reference for those bases on my desktop. I will look for it tomorrow.
 

superduty4x4

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Do not be afraid of modding that base. It really was easy to do with the dremel. I think I also have saved a filter cross reference for those bases on my desktop. I will look for it tomorrow.
That would be great Tom, thanks. I also chatted with Napa's online help and they weren't able to say for sure that the 33680 filter will or won't fit the filter base in part number 24911. I live out in the sticks and my Napa doesn't stock either of these items, and they seemed hesitant to order stuff in to let me try it out. I may try next time I'm in the big city and see if they have the parts and will let me check it out.
 

Tom S

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Here is the 2006 Standadyne Fuel Manager Cross Reference.
 

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Mr. Neutron

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What are the options for a a good clean power source for the wire from the pump to the relay?

I'm using a Painless Performance fuel pump wiring/relay kit for mine. But I'm stumped on how to get power from the battery to the relay.....

Jimmie
 

Tom S

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I nice place to grab power is at the stud terminal on the side of the fuse box. There is a little cover that slides up to see the stud. I think it is on the firewall side of the fuse box. You can mount your painless nearby for a clean look and a short distance to the fuel pump.

I would like to see some photos of your project.
 
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Mr. Neutron

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Thanks, Tom!!

I saw that terminal you speak of when I was "dissecting" my fuse box this afternoon.... I can probably just put a ring terminal on a 12 g. wire, and slip it over that stud, huh?

I had a really long reponse written to explain why I've done what I've done to my fuel system. And somehow I managed to lose it..... :cursing:

In a nutshell, I once had big plans for my 1st '97 truck (intercooler, injectors, & stuff). I started laying a "foundation" for those plans. Got sidetracked, and the plans sorta changed. I more or less began setting up an electric fuel system 8 yrs. ago, on that 1st truck. That truck got totalled, and I put the "trick stuff" from that truck on another '97 crew cab. So the pics are old, and I don't have any photos of the latest stuff I've done. I'll try to remedy that soon. In the meantime, here's a few old pics of what I originally did, on my other 5-speed truck:

http://rides.webshots.com/album/64496359JdtjxP

Not really very "sophisticated" stuff compared to what guys have done lately. But back in 2003, when the idea to go electric" was more or less a new idea for the '94-'97 trucks, it was fairly trick. It's also held up really well over the years, which I like.....

Thanks for the help, Tom! I truly appreciate it! Hope I can be of help to you, and others here sometime....

Jimmie
 

Mr. Neutron

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Yeah, Thank You VERY MUCHO, Tom S!!!! :whs:

Under a sliding plastic cover, on the extreme end of the under hood fuse box nearest the driver's side fender, is a 13mm flanged locknut on a bolt/stud type of affair. Sliding that cover up, and pulling it off, it's easy to get to that locknut. Removing the locknut shows a square-shaped ring terminal on the end of a large gauge, heavy yellow cable. I'm gonna assume this is where the power comes from for the fuse box? Anyway, I put a ring terminal on the end of my 12 ga. wire (goes to a 30 amp fuse, then, ultimately to my relay), slid that over the post, & tightened up the 13mm locknut. Power problem fixed, I do believe.....

That helped a whole bunch. I'm one of these guys that will stand on their bumper, truck hood up, scratchin' my head for hours trying to figure out stuff sometimes. And those times are when I truly appreciate a message board/forum like this, and the folks that make them work.

It's raining outside now; nothing new here in western Oregon, it seems... Since my truck is parked outside of my pole barn, I got pretty wet the couple of times I was able to get a little work done on the fuel pump wiring. :cursing: I'd almost kill for, say, 3-5 days in a row of dry weather. Or, maybe I could build another wired/concrete floored barn, to be able to actually work on my truck outta the rain & etc.. With all the junk I have in my shop, it'd be easier to simply build another barn, I think. Any of you guys Amish, by any chance? :D

But anyway, I'm really confident the power source Tom told me of will work just fine. Hopefully, the weather guessers will be correct on tomorrow's forecast, and it'll be dry enough to get some work done on the truck. Lookin' forward to seeing if my plumbing has any leaks..... :rolleyes:

Again, Thanks for your help, Tom S. I appreciate that a lot!

Jimmie
 

Tom S

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I looked at your photos you have an interesting filter set up on there.
 

Mr. Neutron

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Thanks, Tom.

I originally had really big plans & ideas for my truck, like an intercooler, bigger injectors, chip/tuner, & such. I began laying down the foundation, then the green '97 5-speed I had got hit & totalled out. I bought that truck from the insurance co., and yanked some parts off it to put on my new "pink" colored E4OD '97. Not long after I got some of the goodies onto the "new" '97 truck, I kinda got sidetracked, and was having more fun riding dirt bikes & racing mx with old guys. I simply wanted a truck to haul my travel trailer & dirt bikes around at that point. Getting tired of chasing fuel leaks in the oem stuff, and changing mechanical fuel pumps, I decided to get an electric pump installed, like I'd planned on doing years ago......

I have only one fuel tank, a 33 gallon Bronco tank, from the Bronco Graveyard. My old fuel selector switch/valve got plugged up & trashed after a fill up from a truck stop in Baker City, OR. They gave me a little bit of #2 fuel, and a LOT of rust. It was cheaper to get the 33 gallon tank than to buy a new tank selector switch. It also simplified my fuel loop. I have a 5/8" pickup in the tank, going out of the tank to -10 (5/8" i.d.) Aeroquip Push-Lock hose. From there it goes to the Webb VorMax dual filter setup.The Webb VorMax is off a class 8 otr setup. I'm not certain if they're sold anymore. It has a water separator, with a clear bowl on it. It basically separates some really dispicable slime & water/gunk from the fuel, and will filter down to the size of, small gravel, maybe. It's basically a tricked out sediment bowl. From there, my fuel goes into a Fleetguard FS1000 fuel filter/water separator. That filter is good down to 10 microns, I believe. This much is all accomplished just on the VorMax filter head. More Aeroquip hose (-8, or 1/2" i.d.) carries fuel a feet away to another Fleetguard filter head. That few feet of room between the two filter heads gives plenty of room for an electric pump, and it allows some "Pre-filtering" of the fuel before it gets to the pump. One of my biggest marvels is how Ford figured a setup where unfiltered fuel goes to the fuel pump is a "Good Thing"????

My second filter screens junk out down to 2 microns. I forget the Fleetguard p/n, but the thing is like 9" or so long. The whole setup is supposed to be good for 100K mile filter change intervals, but I do it once a year anyways.....

From the 2nd filter to the injectors is fairly standard, I guess. I used -6 (3/8" i.d.) aeroquip hose along the frame rail, up to the last chunk of factory stainless line, where I have a flareless fitting to connect my hose to that line. From the front part of the frame up to the engine, I use the stock stainless steel line. It feeds to a Summit Racing Y-Block fitting. That Y-fitting splits into 2 steel 5/16" hard lines I bent, and into the back of the heads. The unused fuel goes into my Aeromotive adjustable bypass regulator, which I think is a model 13109, but I can't recall exactly right now.... Then the fuel goes back to the tank.

There's a lot messed up in my fuel system, from a performance standpoint. You can basically only flow what the smallest opening will give ya, and those 1/8"-27 NPT inlets into each head don't allow a very large fuel line to be used. But like I said, out-and-out performance isn't my goal here, anymore. I plumbed in the Carter SD replacement pump between the filters, necking stuff down to 5/16", like the pump uses, and then back up to 3/8" after leaving the 2 micron filter. Oh well..... It'll flow plenty enough for me, and hopefully be reliable, leak less, and be easier to fix should a problem arise.

That's all I have so far. It's always in a constant state of tweaking, for reliabilty reasons, usually. I'm hoping the electric setup, and lack of leaks, will give me a little better running truck, and maybe a little better fuel mileage. And hopefully, maybe support a tuner or chip I wanna get soon, hee hee.......

Thanks again, Tom! And if my econo setup gives anyhone questions, please don't hesitate to ask. I know there are better systems on other guys' trucks out there, but maybe something I've done can help others, maybe.... Or, show them how NOT to do a fuel system, lol.....

Jimmie
 

Mr. Neutron

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Well, I got it runnin'!!! :redspotdance:

So far, after sitting & idling for 20 minutes, then a 6-7 mile test ride, and then 5 minutes more idling in the driveway, I've found no leaks! :joy:

The truck idles noticeably smoother now, which is really nice. :thumbsup:

Hopefully, it'll continue with it's "No Leak" policy. Maybe my fuel mileage will increase slightly, now that I'm not leaking a quart every few miles.... :rolleyes:

Side note: I was back in Oklahoma last week, visiting family. My rental car was a new Mustang, and my sister has a blown Roush Mustang. I've been riding my YZ450F since I've been back in OR. Combined, they all make my truck feel like a real turd.... :frustrate: time for a Doritos chip, I reckon.....

Thanks all!!!

Jimmie
 

CSIPSD

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Yeah, Thank You VERY MUCHO, Tom S!!!! :whs:

Under a sliding plastic cover, on the extreme end of the under hood fuse box nearest the driver's side fender, is a 13mm flanged locknut on a bolt/stud type of affair. Sliding that cover up, and pulling it off, it's easy to get to that locknut. Removing the locknut shows a square-shaped ring terminal on the end of a large gauge, heavy yellow cable. I'm gonna assume this is where the power comes from for the fuse box? Anyway, I put a ring terminal on the end of my 12 ga. wire (goes to a 30 amp fuse, then, ultimately to my relay), slid that over the post, & tightened up the 13mm locknut. Power problem fixed, I do believe.....

That helped a whole bunch. I'm one of these guys that will stand on their bumper, truck hood up, scratchin' my head for hours trying to figure out stuff sometimes. And those times are when I truly appreciate a message board/forum like this, and the folks that make them work.

It's raining outside now; nothing new here in western Oregon, it seems... Since my truck is parked outside of my pole barn, I got pretty wet the couple of times I was able to get a little work done on the fuel pump wiring. :cursing: I'd almost kill for, say, 3-5 days in a row of dry weather. Or, maybe I could build another wired/concrete floored barn, to be able to actually work on my truck outta the rain & etc.. With all the junk I have in my shop, it'd be easier to simply build another barn, I think. Any of you guys Amish, by any chance? :D

But anyway, I'm really confident the power source Tom told me of will work just fine. Hopefully, the weather guessers will be correct on tomorrow's forecast, and it'll be dry enough to get some work done on the truck. Lookin' forward to seeing if my plumbing has any leaks..... :rolleyes:

Again, Thanks for your help, Tom S. I appreciate that a lot!

Jimmie

Well another Oregon boy!!! Welcome from Bend (when I am there...)
 

Tom S

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I need to pick up a bender and a flare tool for this job, give me your thoughts on this kit:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00947752000P?prdNo=4

I think what you have there is a regular plumbing flare tool. Hydraulic/JIC/AN fittings you a different type of tool with a different deg angle. I think one is 45 and the other 37deg. I bought a Rigid flare to do to mine at the suggestion of Dennis at ITP/Sinister Diesel. He was working on a OBS fuel system I think FYI.
 

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