B codes vs hybrids

[Bmcgarvie]

Hey everyone! So I've tried searching it but not a ton of info on b codes vs hybrids. Seems like 99 percent of people agree hybrids are better mostly from a hpo standpoint. But I'm curious if you hypothetically had two identical trucks running the basic stuff along with a bts dual hpop system only difference being injectors. One has B-code 250/100 the other hybrid 250/100. What are the pros and cons to either? Again I'm not looking to dig up the oil hungry issues of the b codes. Would one have better drivability? Power? Smoke? Egts? Mileage? Alright school me!

 

[psmike]

subd im running 250's 100 an bts pumps.. truck runs really good.. curious about what hybrid diff would make.

 

[superpsd]

I run B codes. Many have said driveability is better with the B codes but with proper tuning hybrids work just fine. B codes are less popular as they cost more and most builders require B cores. Of course then you also need a high volume hpop so the cost is substantially higher. A BD code injector is a 240cc injector out of the box just needs a nozzle swap. The B codes have a higher VOP out of the box but you can build an hybrid with B code nozzle springs. Higher VOP means better atomization with the downside of less actual PW per commanded PW. A codes shine at lower rpms. B codes shine in the mid range and hybrids win for all out power.

 

[Bmcgarvie]

I run B codes. Many have said driveability is better with the B codes but with proper tuning hybrids work just fine. B codes are less popular as they cost more and most builders require B cores. Of course then you also need a high volume hpop so the cost is substantially higher. A BD code injector is a 240cc injector out of the box just needs a nozzle swap. The B codes have a higher VOP out of the box but you can build an hybrid with B code nozzle springs. Higher VOP means better atomization with the downside of less actual PW per commanded PW. A codes shine at lower rpms. B codes shine in the mid range and hybrids win for all out power.

So money and oil requirements aside it sound like a set of b code would be the
Ticket for the most part.

 

[superpsd]

So money and oil requirements aside it sound like a set of b code would be the
Ticket for the most part.

Some prefer the hybrids and some prefer the B codes. There have been hundreds of arguments on here about B codes vs Hybrids if you want to dig further on here thru old threads.

 

[Hotrodtractor]

It all depends on what the goals for the build are and how it will be used.

All out horsepower and higher RPMs - hybrids.

All the torque and lower RPMs - B codes.

The reality that is somewhere in between the two above points requires a lot more information and a whole lot more guestimation. Unless you have a specific reason to go to B codes, just do the hybrids. The tuning is there, they are understood, cheaper to get, etc....

I've ran both - both have pros and cons.

 

[Charles]

Old thread.... but close to a topic I am working through right now so I will respond in case it may be useful down the line.

IIRC.... with larger nozzles, like a 200 or 400 for instance, the Hybrid flows more fuel with the same pw and icp on the bench and in the truck. The only way that is possible is if it achieves a higher injection pressure behind that nozzle.

If we could graph actual injection pressure vs icp for a B-code and a hybrid with both running say a 200 EDM and plot ICP on the X-axis and actual injection pressure on the Y-axis, I expect that you would see the B-code graph start off and climb as icp increased but start to lay down and just barely be increasing at some point, my hunch being, beyond 2100 to 2500 or so psi. I expect you would see the hybrid start lower but climb and continue to climb right on past 2500 and 2800 to 3000 or so and then lay down again. So basically... the B-code is less dynamic. You can achieve the B-code injection pressure down low by writing your programming to call for more icp to pw ratio. But the B-code can never keep up on the top, no matter what you do.

Now VOP..... that's an entirely different topic...

And lastly..... B-code is a 6:1 and it outflows the A-code, which is a 7:1. Hybrid is a 5:1 and it outflows the 6:1 B-code..... anybody want to guess what will happen with an overbored body, bushed down to a machined intensifier piston atop a B-code plunger in a 4:1.... or a 3:1 ratio.....

YEP....

It will happen again... but maybe from 3000 - 3500psi, or 3500 - 4000psi....

 

[Powerstroke Cowboy]

From what Jim said the B-Codes flow more than the Hybrid with 100% nozzles and with 200% nozzles the hybrids just edge out the B-codes. I believe you ate remembering right.

I wonder how much affect a larger poppet valve would have on the flow of the B-codes and Hybrids?

 

[Charles]

From what Jim said the B-Codes flow more than the Hybrid with 100% nozzles and with 200% nozzles the hybrids just edge out the B-codes. I believe you ate remembering right.

I wonder how much affect a larger poppet valve would have on the flow of the B-codes and Hybrids?

I think hydraulic pressure is easier to accomplish by simply asking for less Rotella flow rather than constantly trying to flow 5 or 6 or 7 TIMES as much Rotella as fuel. Everybody else is just flowing fuel. Imagine if a CR guy suddenly had to flow 5 or 6 TIMES as much fuel per millisecond to make the SAME power..... done. No way. No chance.

We just have to stop flowing so damn much fluid all the time if we expect HEUI to make power. Drop the demand. Reduce the intensifier bore. I don't think we are even coming CLOSE to the theoretical hydraulic ratios on any of these larger nozzles. As I stated in another thread, I kept coming up with 7 - 9k psi on a 200 EDM based on flow compared to known rates for CR nozzles with known pressures.

Also.... the poppet, again, is a tight tolerance machined part, with highly fragile hydraulic balances on its faces. Altering it is an order of magnitude more complex than making a smaller intensifier...

Either way.... you get 400cc. Asking a hydraulic pump to do 3500 or 4000psi is certainly easier than altering all the dynamics involved with that poppet. And that's ignoring the machining, finishing, metallurgical, inertial and physical complexities.