Blew up my GTP38R
- Thread starter Kylerf150
- Start date
David N
Active member
Sorry if I missed it, but to the OP, does your truck have forged rods?
Jennifer@Dieselsite
New member
Really, thread?
Ball-bearings are more susceptible to debris in your oil and it's scarily common for me to hear from a customer "I bought this turbo because it's indestructible" because no one told them that while the 38R will go forever, it does have a weakness. Debris. Anything that will cause those ball bearings to seize and stop... just like a stick in the roller blade.
Wheels are already balanced before they're assembled in the turbos. Garrett builds them the same way. They don't take the whole turbo after it's built and then "balance it". They literally balance all the parts individually (including your stock wheel) and then assemble. That really loud sound that comes from the 38R and annoys your wife? That's due to it's balancing specs or really, the lack there of.
I've had a small handful of claims over the past year (but our sales also went up over the past 1-2 years, too) each has come back as ingestion. You can't hide the scarring from debris on your internals.
Ball-bearings are more susceptible to debris in your oil and it's scarily common for me to hear from a customer "I bought this turbo because it's indestructible" because no one told them that while the 38R will go forever, it does have a weakness. Debris. Anything that will cause those ball bearings to seize and stop... just like a stick in the roller blade.
Wheels are already balanced before they're assembled in the turbos. Garrett builds them the same way. They don't take the whole turbo after it's built and then "balance it". They literally balance all the parts individually (including your stock wheel) and then assemble. That really loud sound that comes from the 38R and annoys your wife? That's due to it's balancing specs or really, the lack there of.
I've had a small handful of claims over the past year (but our sales also went up over the past 1-2 years, too) each has come back as ingestion. You can't hide the scarring from debris on your internals.
SEABEE08FX4
New member
In all the years we've been selling Garrett turbos I've only seen two GTP38R's come back for warranty claims. One had dried silicone in the oil supply port, the other had a aftermarket wheel installed ( batmowheel IIRC ). Balancing individually is one thing, but after you assemble those parts the assembly will not be balanced as a whole just because each individual part was previously balanced separately. Once you bolt two of those parts together the balancing goes out the window. The proper way, and IMO the only acceptable way is to balance them as an assembly. And all this really means is taking your compressor wheel and turbine wheel, putting them together and balancing them as so. Make a reference mark on the compressor wheel and the shaft so when they go back together you know where to index the compressor wheel on the shaft as it was when balanced.
^^^^^^^ WHS
If someone wants to swap the wheel on a 38R, that's fine.... but do it the right way.
As I said before, it's always been very rare that someone blew up a 38R. Not to say it hasn't happened, but try searching this and other forums and you'll come with very few threads in years past.
But what you will find are a handful of more recent threads of 38R's letting go, and all having one thing in common.... the compressor wheel was swapped.
I saw a thread on another forum where a guy blew up two 38R's in a row. Both times it was with a WW. Never balanced.
So you think the relatively large number of 38R failures, most of which have been shafts snapping and/or "aftermarket" wheels coming apart, have nothing to do with balancing the turbo?
Jennifer@Dieselsite
New member
Not when the warranty claim comes back with "ingestion ; scarring and debris present".
Garrett won't cover a warranty with an after-market wheel, but they're nice enough to tell us why they fail if we have a claim.
Garrett won't cover a warranty with an after-market wheel, but they're nice enough to tell us why they fail if we have a claim.
PSD POWER007
Member
As I think about this...I wonder if the significant weight difference between the exhaust wheel and the billet wheels puts additional stress on the shaft regardless of whether it's been balanced or not. Might be way off base in my thinking...
Seems there would be more "down force" on the exhaust side bearing from more weight on that end of the shaft and more "up force" on the billet wheel side bearing.
Seems there would be more "down force" on the exhaust side bearing from more weight on that end of the shaft and more "up force" on the billet wheel side bearing.
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SEABEE08FX4
New member
Not really, in most cases the cast wheel is lighter. Billet or FMW are more for toughness, they can take a beating better and won't scatter like a cast wheel. In some cases there are profiles that are higher flowing than their cast counter parts due to the wheel profiles that can be achieved on a CNC that can't be duplicated in a sand cast mold.
PSD POWER007
Member
My cast 38r wheel was noticeably heavier than the 38r WW2 and D66WW2. That's only reason the thought came to mind.
SEABEE08FX4
New member
Just depends on the application and who's wheel, it goes both ways at times.
PSD POWER007
Member
Gotcha! I've only used Dieselsite wheels. They have always felt lighter than stock.
I have the factory installed billet wheel on my BASB, so I don't know how it compares weight wise.
Tom S
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Interesting information, I have been to Turbonetics and went on a full tour of the facility. I saw the machine where they did a balance after assembly. I am not sure exactly what they did for balancing pre-assembly. They ground on the wheel in the area of the nut with a grinder to establish a balance. I am trying to remember if my 38r had those same grind marks.
Kylerf150
New member
I checked a long time ago going off the production number on the valve cover. It says forged but honestly I don't trust that and need to crawl under the truck and pull the plug.
gnxtc2
Active member
My BASB came with a cast wheel. When the billet wheel came out for the BASB, I called Pius if I could purchase it. He told me that I can buy it but the turbo needs to go back to him so he can re-balance it.
A ball bearing center section can NOT be rebuilt. So when a ball bearing center section goes bad, it goes in the trash.
Billy T.
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drunk on diesel
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I still haven't heard EVERYTHING yet, but you just got me a LOT closer
you can't be serious with this :doh:
ointlaugh:
Arisley
Moderator
I like Dieselsite, but, really?
Jennifer@Dieselsite
New member
I'm dead serious. You can call Garrett and ask them yourself and I heard it straight from their mouth several times. The 38R balancing specs are different than on other turbos and it contributes to their particular roar.
You ever read one of those "there's an absurd amount of play in my brand new out of box 38R?" threads? Among all the typical reasons this would happen, balancing is also a factor.
You ever read one of those "there's an absurd amount of play in my brand new out of box 38R?" threads? Among all the typical reasons this would happen, balancing is also a factor.
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