jeremiahmercier
Member
Tim is one of the best guys ive worked with, and so is jody. So just give it time to work out
E99 Build-up (UW Mitch Build Thread)
- Thread starter uw mitch
- Start date
Injector and baggie of broken/bent pins out for delivery today, so I'm hoping to hear from Tim. I know he's got a solid reputation, I'm happy with his product, but a little disappointed I haven't heard from him at all on this. Hopefully he's just waiting to see the pins with his own eyes before replying.
~Mitch
BilletGarage
New member
Very cool project and nice work so far! I was an installer (car audio and alarms) back in the early to mid 90's. It's a lot of fun! Will be following your progress. 
I'm disappointed to say, that I never heard from Tim directly, even though Jody sent on my phone number and email address. While I like the product, the after sales support was not was I was hoping for. When the injector broke, and we sent pictures of the carnage he did send a replacement injector, but Wes had already fixed the broken injector. I understand that for his peace of mind, not knowing Wes, he wanted me to put his injector in, which cost me another $150 in labor. Net-net, I spent $200 to get the broken injector fixed and my truck back on the road, then another $150 to swap out the fixed injector for one direct from Tim - a total of $350.
This morning Jody let me know that "I talked to Tim and they do not cover labor as part of their warranty. He said they sent the replacement injector per their warranty. " That's disappointing after all of this. I bought injectors, there was an internal failure (broken/bent pins), net-net it has cost me an extra $350 out of pocket.
Luckily, while Tim wasn't willing to do what I think would "make it right" Jody offered me a credit with him, which was the equivalent to all that he made on selling the injectors. So even though, I'm still out some, I appreciate that Jody was willing to work with me to not leave a total sour taste in my mouth.
In summary: Like the injectors, wouldn't recommend PIS when it comes to what I think is "taking care of your customers" with after sales support if something happens. Very happy that Jody was willing to offer me something to take care of me to try to make it right.
~Mitch
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How do I embed youtube?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OBWd5lb6jk
I think if I've calculated back correctly, with the 8100lbs I tipped the scales with at the O-Dot weigh station, that puts me right around 480HP. Way higher than I was shooting for an expecting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OBWd5lb6jk
I think if I've calculated back correctly, with the 8100lbs I tipped the scales with at the O-Dot weigh station, that puts me right around 480HP. Way higher than I was shooting for an expecting.
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TERRCO
Member
Looks clean. Copy the URL and paste here
Tim @ P.I.S.
New member
If you would like to make this public I am more than happy to do so.
First lets set the scene for this story. You purchased your injectors through Jody at DP Tuner. Our warranty covers any injector we sell for the period of one year for any failure caused by parts/workmanship. We nor anyone else I know of in our business covers the cost of labor for removal/installation of parts.
Secondly we(P.I.S./DP Tuner) were not notified of any issues from you until an email was sent to Jody and forwarded to me. This email clearly stated you felt you had a faulty injector, and instead of contacting any of the parties involved with this transaction you took it upon yourself to have your "buddy" that also builds injectors to remove/disassemble and repair said injector.
Under any circumstances this ultimately voids any warranty you have with your P.I.S. product. But to make all parties feel warm and fuzzy of the claimed issue we(P.I.S.) sent a matched injector to insure you had a balanced set of injectors and not one that was installed after being disassembled and not tested. 1,000 things can go wrong on just simply assembling an injector to cause it to function poorly or not even work at all.
I will even share the claimed issue that was said to be found. Other builders feel free to chime in with your opinions, it is welcomed and encouraged. The picture I was forwarded showed two allegedly bent dowel pins that are used to locate the nozzle to the spacer sleeve(keeps orientation of the nozzle holes in relation to the piston bowl). And a third dowel pin(broken in two) that was claimed to be in the same cavity at the nozzle spring and the stop pin.
This injector was returned to us and we inspected this injector thoroughly. I just find it odd to have an extra dowel pin to be found in a cavity it clearly can not fit into and with no other signs of damage to the spring or inside bore of the sleeve.
In conclusion, by our rules you voided your warranty by allowing your "buddy that just so happens to build injectors per you to dissect our product. We over looked that and still sent a matched injector so you would have no issues down the road from another shops hack into our product that we could possibly get blamed for down the road.
And for this we are getting several post from you stating faults with our customer service.
I do appreciate the comments on how your product performs. I do hope you enjoy your set of injectors. You are entitled to your opinion and you are welcome to share that in an open forum such this. Just like I am now.
Just when I was about to post that I got a really nice phone call from David this afternoon and we talk about what he saw on the injector that DFI fixed (flowed perfect) and his wanting to talk to Wes directly to understand more about how the failure could've occurred, and was about to explain how I didn't give it enough time to hear from you guys...
Anyways, Tim, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on what excellent customer service is. You feel sending me a new injector is sufficient.
I feel that as a customer, I bought a set of injectors, and expected them to "just work" when professionally installed. Something happened to my truck the day before I had to go on a trip for work, and Wes from DFI Performance had me tow my truck to his shop on a holiday when they were closed, diagnosed Injector #8 wasn't working, pulled it, inspected it, discovered 1 broken pin and 2 bent pins. Replaced the pins, put on a newer injector cap, and got me on the road. It cost me $200 and about 3 hours of Wes' time on a holiday. Putting in the replacement injector, which I appreciate you sending, cost me another $150. So as a customer, I would have expected:
- Someone from PIS to call and say, **** happens, we're really sorry. David actually did that today. I really appreciated the conversation. It might have been nicer to have been able to talk to you, but I think you were unavailable.
- Maybe, if you were really awesome and not just ok at customer service, you would've said "Hey we know it's not your fault something went wrong with the injector, and you had a professional shop do the repair work, we see a lot of botched DIY. We can see they do good work as the fixed injector flowed perfectly. How about we meet you in the middle and split the bill" (or even take on the whole labor cost, but in my conversation with David, I understand why you don't.
- But instead, you seem to be all mad (I guess as a small business owner I don't blame you) and are trying to skate on the fact that I had a shop diagnose and fix my problem. I did in fact contact Jody, who talked on the phone to you about it. I talked to Jody the day after my truck was fixed while I was waiting at the airport for my flight (thank goodness my truck was fixed, otherwise based on where I live I would've had to spend about $120 on a cab ride to the airport if I had left my broken truck at DFI.
So I guess yes, I'm still left not feeling warm and fuzzy. It's ultimately up to future customers to decide. If in the slim chance something goes wrong, are you happy with Tim sending you a replacement injector but your truck being down for some period of time, or do you expect more.
~Mitch
Jason
New member
Doesn't customer service basocally stop, the moment you pull a manufacturers product out, dick with it, then try to get them to fix it? Tim was a lot nicer about it than I would have been.
Chuck B.
New member
Having a professional shop diagnose the problem and replace the the injector is "dicking" with it?
As a business owner I know crap happens. What occurs after is what defines customer service. I feel Tim's portrayal of Wes as a "buddy" is trying to hide the bad injector. Wes is an excellent diesel mechanic who's reputation speaks for itself. Wes working on a holiday to get Mitch back on the road is an indicator of his character and professionalism.
No shop is perfect. Bad injectors happen. I want Tim to explain what is a customer supposed to do if they get a bad injector. What should Mitch have done differently?
Chuck
Jason
New member
Was it not Tim's injector that Wes messed with?? If it was, and someone else messed with Tim's product, Tim has no reason to help the man out. It doesn't matter how skilled of a mechanic Wes is, or if the injector was bad or not.
That's probably easy for you to say looking at your sig with 2 vehicles in it. My truck is my only vehicle - I depend on it to get me and my family places. What would you suggest I have done? Truck breaks, gets towed to the shop, mechanic says it's a dead injector in #8. I have a work trip the next day and have to get to the airport - 50 miles drive. Do I (a) have him fix it and hope that the guy who built the injector that failed takes care of me or (b) leave the truck behind at the shop, ask the mechanic to drive me to a rental car place on Presidents day holiday or spend a large amount of money taking a cab from a rural area to PDX?
Seriously, if this was a toy truck, then fine. When this is a do everything truck it's not really an option to wait around over a holiday weekend and hope that on Tuesday something got be gotten out to me. And I suspect if I had gone with option B, it wouldn't have changed Tim's policy that warranty is for parts only. That's a business decision he's made, and while I don't agree with it, I respect that's his policy now that I've heard from him.
~Mitch
Tim @ P.I.S.
New member
I will be the first to admit sh!t just happens sometimes. I never claimed our product was 100% perfect. Superior, maybe, as of lately our warranty claims have been fewer than the amount of new alliants we have had to send back because out of the box they just don't work.
DO me a favor call up another vendor of a product you have installed on your truck. Say, Terminator Engineering for example, tell him your pump quit working and you had someone break it down and make some "repair" to it and see if you have any type of warranty on that product. Sorry to throw you under the bus Joey
Secondly you are in such close proximity to someone you apparently have a good relationship with that also just so happens to build injectors(per you) but you purchase from completely across the country. I will take that as you felt our product was such more superior to wait for them to be built, wait for the additional shipping time required to be delivered, and that if by some chance in hell there were an issue you would be fine with the shipping time required to solve any warranty claim if needed to be made.
But instead what I received was no phone call or email even stating there was a problem. Only a forwarded email with a bill stating this is what happened and you owe me $XXX. And since you don't pay I will run the forum with my unpleasant experience. But we still made sure you had a balanced set of injectors after everything said and done.
But even after all that I still sit here trying to figure how in the heck Wes managed to pull a square peg out of a round hole per say. That one baffles me, as well as David as we have sat and looked at any way possible for this exact problem to 1) even fit in the cavity and 2) run on the bench flawlessly.
I do apologize for the muck up of your "project" thread. I truly hope you enjoy your truck and I am happy to be apart of another members project and hope you enjoy your product from my company.
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I will be the first to admit sh!t just happens sometimes. I never claimed our product was 100% perfect. Superior, maybe, as of lately our warranty claims have been fewer than the amount of new alliants we have had to send back because out of the box they just don't work.
DO me a favor call up another vendor of a product you have installed on your truck. Say, Terminator Engineering for example, tell him your pump quit working and you had someone break it down and make some "repair" to it and see if you have any type of warranty on that product. Sorry to throw you under the bus Joey
Secondly you are in such close proximity to someone you apparently have a good relationship with that also just so happens to build injectors(per you) but you purchase from completely across the country. I will take that as you felt our product was such more superior to wait for them to be built, wait for the additional shipping time required to be delivered, and that if by some chance in hell there were an issue you would be fine with the shipping time required to solve any warranty claim if needed to be made.
But instead what I received was no phone call or email even stating there was a problem. Only a forwarded email with a bill stating this is what happened and you owe me $XXX. And since you don't pay I will run the forum with my unpleasant experience. But we still made sure you had a balanced set of injectors after everything said and done.
But even after all that I still sit here trying to figure how in the heck Wes managed to pull a square peg out of a round hole per say. That one baffles me, as well as David as we have sat and looked at any way possible for this exact problem to 1) even fit in the cavity and 2) run on the bench flawlessly.
I do apologize for the muck up of your "project" thread. I truly hope you enjoy your truck and I am happy to be apart of another members project and hope you enjoy your product from my company.
I basically like Jody's product (tuner and tunes), so when it came time for injectors, Wes and I talked about it and he suggested go with one of the two guys Jody sells as he probably is more intimately familiar with the injection characteristics of your and Ryan's injectors. Based on your being outspoken about customer service I chose your injectors. If not yours I would've gone with Full Force.
Per talking to David today, when Jody sells a set of injectors he's the first line support for taking care of any issues. Jody let me know that he passed my email and phone number on to you and that I could expect a call. I got no call.
In none of my emails did I threaten you that if you didn't reimburse me I was going to "run the forum with my unpleasant experience" - I was hoping at best have my problem resolved to MY satisfaction and at worse, get a phone call or email explaining why. Today I got that call.
I had a couple posts, where I clearly stated, that I liked your product and was just not happy with the after sales support. In my own build thread I elaborated on that. I haven't crapped in anyone else's threads asking about you, nor in your forum, nor lodged a general complaint thread crying like a baby. Actually, my only posts outside my own 2 threads about your injectors was this one:
http://powerstrokearmy.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45827
I was initially very excited. The experience I had dampened that excitement, talking to David this afternoon pretty much made me feel mostly satisfied, but then seeing your reaction here kind of sours the whole thing all over again.
When David and I spoke this afternoon I gave him Wes' personal cell phone number as he wanted to talk to better understand what Wes saw when he got the injector apart - where the broken pin part was exactly, etc. I sent Wes an email and he's expecting David's call. Hopefully once they talk, David or you can maybe explain a little more, as this seems like an opportunity to improve your process even further (aka better failure rate than new injectors).
~Mitch
Mitch I.understand your frustration but business as usual in an injector failure is you get a replacement injector. If you choose to.have someone else.perform the injector r&r thats a cost outside the injector purchase. Reading the warranty with the injector will tell you this.
Taking apart something always voids the warranty. Swamps.taking apart a PIS injector.voids the warranty as does anybody else for.example.
You technically werent owed an injector.after Wes(?) took it apart.
Taking apart something always voids the warranty. Swamps.taking apart a PIS injector.voids the warranty as does anybody else for.example.
You technically werent owed an injector.after Wes(?) took it apart.
10-4. Got the message loud and clear. Something goes south, park the truck until the vendor you bought the stuff from sends a replacement. No labor warranties in this industry.
FWIW, the combination of injectors, Bell Turbo BASB, T500, DFI T4 kit and Jody's tunes pushed my 8100lb to a sub 15 second 1/4 mile, which exceeded my power expectations for the build.
~Mitch
FWIW, the combination of injectors, Bell Turbo BASB, T500, DFI T4 kit and Jody's tunes pushed my 8100lb to a sub 15 second 1/4 mile, which exceeded my power expectations for the build.
~Mitch
Tree Trimmer
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replacing a injector, can be done by yourself, with a basic set of hand tools, and, to properly do it, a in/lb torque wrench.
takes probably a hour, hour and a half to do one, taking your time.
its easy.
as a side note, uw mitch, what you do for a living?
takes probably a hour, hour and a half to do one, taking your time.
its easy.
as a side note, uw mitch, what you do for a living?
From how I've watched Wes swap injectors, he goes in and has a vacuum system to suck any oil/fuel out of the hole that the injector came out of then goes in with an inspection camera to make sure the whole thing is clean and looking good. I'd rather have him do it than me just for the risk of a f@ck up factor. But anyway, I guess that's my choice to pay a pro to work on things I'm not comfortable with than just try it based on reading instructions on the internet
For a living - well I'm trained as an electrical engineer and I work for a big tech company (you can probably figure out which one based on my location) in developer relations working with the video game industry. I also have my own little side hobby business making stuff: https://www.facebook.com/mitchlumMachined
~Mitch
For a living - well I'm trained as an electrical engineer and I work for a big tech company (you can probably figure out which one based on my location) in developer relations working with the video game industry. I also have my own little side hobby business making stuff: https://www.facebook.com/mitchlumMachined
~Mitch
ja_cain
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Cool tops! What equipment you turning those tops with. I would love to try making one. Also, what camera gear you shoot with?From how I've watched Wes swap injectors, he goes in and has a vacuum system to suck any oil/fuel out of the hole that the injector came out of then goes in with an inspection camera to make sure the whole thing is clean and looking good. I'd rather have him do it than me just for the risk of a f@ck up factor. But anyway, I guess that's my choice to pay a pro to work on things I'm not comfortable with than just try it based on reading instructions on the internet
For a living - well I'm trained as an electrical engineer and I work for a big tech company (you can probably figure out which one based on my location) in developer relations working with the video game industry. I also have my own little side hobby business making stuff: https://www.facebook.com/mitchlumMachined
~Mitch
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