Fuel cooler

[Big Bore]

I've herd of this setup before, and a few people think its a much better design like yourself.

But why doesnt any of the big boys use/sell it ? Not being a smartass, I would like to know ?

You would have to ask them to know for sure.

My guesses are:
Cost.
Already invested in RR kits.
A lot of high HP guys make their own fuel system.


Look how much a RR is. Look how much a RR with fuel bowl delete is. Add a 4 way block to that kit. How many people would buy that? Especially after the same companies have been selling everyone on fuel heaters/regulated return kits.

How many sell a drop in compound setup? How many sell a drop in mechanical or CR setup? How many people are running those? How many of them post on the internet?

BTW, when you say big boys, who are you talking about? Are you talking about HP wise? Internet fame wise? Owning a diesel performance shop wise? Because there are at least a few here that are running 4 way deadhead and in the big HP numbers.

 

[Tom S]

Winter fuel is treated. It doesn't gel in the tank, and it's not going to gel in the lines/cooler either.


I think putting coolers on the fuel line is simply covering up a symptom of sending fuel through the heads then back to the tank. In my opinion a 4 way dead head is a much better solution and a performance enhancement to boot. Do the in tank mods and an AD then a 4 way dead head and you have removed the air, stopped fuel from circulating through the heads and being heated, and improved flow to the injectors without adding a convoluted loop to the fuel lines for no other purpose than to cool the fuel.

Just something to think about.

How about the fuel temps it a highway cruise burning 4 gallons of fuel an hour? I think then you might be running some very hot fuel through the injectors.

 

[Big Bore]

How about the fuel temps it a highway cruise burning 4 gallons of fuel an hour? I think then you might be running some very hot fuel through the injectors.

Any hotter than a stock motor?

 

[Tom S]

Any hotter than a stock motor?

I had done a little testing with my fuel cooler. I will hunt down some of that to compare.

 

[7.3 rocket]

Winter fuel is treated. It doesn't gel in the tank, and it's not going to gel in the lines/cooler either.


I think putting coolers on the fuel line is simply covering up a symptom of sending fuel through the heads then back to the tank. In my opinion a 4 way dead head is a much better solution and a performance enhancement to boot. Do the in tank mods and an AD then a 4 way dead head and you have removed the air, stopped fuel from circulating through the heads and being heated, and improved flow to the injectors without adding a convoluted loop to the fuel lines for no other purpose than to cool the fuel.

Just something to think about.

Just because fuel is treated doesn't mean it can't gel. It gels in fuel filters and lines in equipment and some of our big trucks so there's no reason that it couldn't gel in a pickup as far as I'm concerned. As far as the second part that seems interesting to me but it still dead heads the fuel rails.

 

[TARM]

The issue with fuel gelling is one that if its a issue in your area its already an issue you have had to deal with. If it doesn't happen with the stock system its not going to happen with the modded ones.

As for the dead head 4 port being superior. Its not. While without a cooler it does have the possibility of cooler fuel and some benefits even Charles will be the first to admit there is nothing proven about it one way or the other. What we do know is it does work as does the tradition flow thru design as both have shown to be high HP capable.

Things to consider once a cooler is in play that keeps fuel at close to ambient: Its then flowing thru the heads at a fast speed it should offer cooler fuel. The fact the fuel is flowing at a much higher rate it will actually react quicker to pressure changes in the rail. If you do not think this is case consider that ALL other fuel rail designs are flow thru not 4 port dead head. Do you sincerely think if it was superior that all those ricers and Hot rods would not be using it?!? Where the 4 port dead head had worth and possible benefit which I also think it did was specific to the 7.3 when compared to a traditional RR with no cooler or one not adequate for the cooling job. I think fuel temps are much more critical than most think. I think once you have proper fuel cooling in place and you are running fuel in thru the rear inspection ports with say -6an and out the front ports with -4an into the reg onto a cooler then to the tank those benefits disappear.

 

[Big Bore]

Just because fuel is treated doesn't mean it can't gel. It gels in fuel filters and lines in equipment and some of our big trucks so there's no reason that it couldn't gel in a pickup as far as I'm concerned.

The cooler isn't going to affect that either way. If its gelling, it isn't treated properly.

 

[Big Bore]

I had done a little testing with my fuel cooler. I will hunt down some of that to compare.

What I meant was the fuel won't get any hotter with a 4 way dead head than it would on a stock SD 7.3 that deadheads.

 

[Big Bore]

Things to consider once a cooler is in play that keeps fuel at close to ambient: Its then flowing thru the heads at a fast speed it should offer cooler fuel. The fact the fuel is flowing at a much higher rate it will actually react quicker to pressure changes in the rail. If you do not think this is case consider that ALL other fuel rail designs are flow thru not 4 port dead head. Do you sincerely think if it was superior that all those ricers and Hot rods would not be using it?!? .

I think the fuel supply for the hotrods and ricers is a different issue because their fuel pressure is MUCH higher since it is also injection pressure and pressure variations will have a much bigger effect. In our case it's only supply pressure, and we have plenty of volume. Upping the pressure beyond a certain point (I think 65psi is the generally agreed upon optimum) has proven to have zero gains and some have even posited it has a negative effect. Also remember, the 4 way does have a regulator, its just before the lines going to the heads, so it's still regulated. I know you know that Tarm, thats for others reading this. I'm unconvinced that a flow through design is capable of more volume than 4 lines feeding each corner without having a drop in volume at the end of the line. Especially with the fitting size limitations at the heads.

 

[Dieselboy.]

By big boys I ment the guys with the higher HP and more or lesss the big name vendors that sell.

I've only ever found one guy that sells a 4 corner system over a RR. As bad as it sounds I went with the crowd and figured if its good enough for them, then its good enough for me.

As far as gelling issues in extreme cold. Once up to temp I dont think it would matter. And obviously cold start would make zero difference as there is no airflow through the cooler to cool the fuel even more.

If someone was absolutley positively concerned with fuel gelling as a result to the cooler and strictly the cooler, you could just install a bypass valve or simple connect the lines with a barbed fitting or something else over the winter. But I still dont see gelling as a result of a fuel cooler and only the fuel cooler.

 

[TrailerHauler]

Very interesting at just how many underlying benefits there are to running a fuel cooler. This is definitely something I will be adding to my fuel system build as I see no negative effects. Also it doesn't seem like the return line goes to far off the path that it would normally take off of the engine. Dieselboy, is your return line running along the frame rail from the fuel cooler about where it would be on a stock truck?

 

[Dieselboy.]

Yes it is. A small section of line goes from the RR to the cooler and then the long return line goes from the cooler to the tank.

 

[Big Bore]

By big boys I ment the guys with the higher HP and more or lesss the big name vendors that sell.

I've only ever found one guy that sells a 4 corner system over a RR. As bad as it sounds I went with the crowd and figured if its good enough for them, then its good enough for me.

As far as gelling issues in extreme cold. Once up to temp I dont think it would matter. And obviously cold start would make zero difference as there is no airflow through the cooler to cool the fuel even more.

If someone was absolutley positively concerned with fuel gelling as a result to the cooler and strictly the cooler, you could just install a bypass valve or simple connect the lines with a barbed fitting or something else over the winter. But I still dont see gelling as a result of a fuel cooler and only the fuel cooler.

I don't see anything wrong with how you made your decision. Just pointing out an option that eliminates needing a fuel cooler. As far as fuel gelling in the cooler, if it's going to gel in the cooler, it will gel everywhere else. I live where it gets well below zero and rarely plug my truck in, and in 15 years I haven't had a gel issue.

 

[Dieselboy.]

I don't see anything wrong with how you made your decision. Just pointing out an option that eliminates needing a fuel cooler. As far as fuel gelling in the cooler, if it's going to gel in the cooler, it will gel everywhere else. I live where it gets well below zero and rarely plug my truck in, and in 15 years I haven't had a gel issue.

Exactly.

 

[Tree Trimmer]

do you have the intank mods done, and with "external" filters, or still have the stock fuel bowl?

imo, its also truck specific, whether it will gel. i did some personal testing on that exact issue.

two trucks. mine, E99 with at the time stock fuel bowl, filled my truck up, and parked it in the middle of the yard. for a week.

my buddies truck, L99 with stock fuel bowl, filled at the same time, with the same fuel, parked about 10 feet from mine, in the front yard.

we were both nearly empty when we filled up. the trucks were facing the same direction when we parked them.

we ran two drop cords to them, and plugged them in for 45 mins, and tried to start them.

his gelled, mine did not. all it took to start his was replace the fuel filter. both of our heaters worked.

i dont know how "scientific" that particular test could be classified as, but it satisfied my curiosity, that for all intents and purposes, aint a damn thing you can do to stop it from happening. if it wants to gel, its goin to.

on a side note, i have never ran fuel additives. i get my diesel delivered, so i always get straight #2, i request it not be blended in the winter. and have never had a gelling issue. in any truck of mine. my neighbor, next door, who gets fuel from in town at the pump, has a gelling problem ATLEAST once a year

 

[Dieselboy.]

do you have the intank mods done, and with "external" filters, or still have the stock fuel bowl?

imo, its also truck specific, whether it will gel. i did some personal testing on that exact issue.

two trucks. mine, E99 with at the time stock fuel bowl, filled my truck up, and parked it in the middle of the yard. for a week.

my buddies truck, L99 with stock fuel bowl, filled at the same time, with the same fuel, parked about 10 feet from mine, in the front yard.

we were both nearly empty when we filled up. the trucks were facing the same direction when we parked them.

we ran two drop cords to them, and plugged them in for 45 mins, and tried to start them.

his gelled, mine did not. all it took to start his was replace the fuel filter. both of our heaters worked.

i dont know how "scientific" that particular test could be classified as, but it satisfied my curiosity, that for all intents and purposes, aint a damn thing you can do to stop it from happening. if it wants to gel, its goin to.

on a side note, i have never ran fuel additives. i get my diesel delivered, so i always get straight #2, i request it not be blended in the winter. and have never had a gelling issue. in any truck of mine. my neighbor, next door, who gets fuel from in town at the pump, has a gelling problem ATLEAST once a year

Not sure if the first question is directed at me, but yes full fuel system. 5/8" pickup to 1/2" line feeding the bulkhead (10micron filter) to 2 SD pumps (3/8" line) back into the bulkhead into a 2 micron filter, 1/2" line to the heads and 3/8" hardline RR to the heads. From the regulator 1/2" line to the fuel cooler (stock 7.3 trans cooler) and 1/2" line back to the tank.