Potential PCM Issues

ja_cain · Oct 26, 2015

Trying to help out a buddy of mine. He has a 00 with with 180/80's, TS Chip and tunes from ********. PCM is NVK4. Truck was running real rough and idle was jumping all around. It had a bunch of codes on it when I scanned it. Some of them made me think the IPR might be having issues but did not have a chance to run it down the road and look at all the usual suspect parameters related to this. I had him pull the connector once he got home and sure enough there was oil on the connector. That helped some but it still is running like chit. He thought maybe the TS chip wasn't making contact, so
he also had the J3 connector re-tinned and it is still running like chit. I have posted a pic of what it looked like before. There was definitely a fair amount of copper showing and pin 3 actually looks damaged. I don't have an after pic yet but will post one up once he sends me one. It may be that re-tinning may not have been able to fix the 3rd contact and that is still causing the issue.

I told him that I would post up the info and see what you guys think. I would like to see if I can source him a replacement PCM to try out. Looking on ebay they seem to go for around 6 to 7 hundred. I think that is BS. If anyone has a cheaper source, I would greatly appreciate the info. Here is a pic of the PCM code and the J3 connector. Thanks in advance for any help guys.

Oh, one more thing, I told him to just have a mild tune flashed to his PCM once he gets everything figured out. Seems like a no brainer, in case the chip craps out.

Justin

Jomax · Oct 26, 2015

Pull the chip and see if that stops it. It will run without a chip.

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TyCorr · Oct 26, 2015

Nvk is the butter if all strategies. Idles great.

tuning pcms of that family will render pmt style tuning though.

And yes if the injectors arent turds it'll idle just fine with the chip unplugged. What pcm is in your truck Justin? You could pull yours and see if it helps his issues. But i wouldnt let him use his chip on your pcm. My nvk4 ran an e99 just fine that we suspected a pcm failure in. In fact he bought a used nvk5 to replace his xle tunes. We were using php and a burner at the time so he just downloaded tunes off bills database for the nvk5 pcm and its been fine since. He said it idles better than ever.

ja_cain · Oct 27, 2015

He is working a lot of hours right now, so its hard to nail him down long enough to really spend some serious time troubleshooting it a systematic way. I told him to get me a video of it before unplugging and after. The frustrating thing is that he doesn't know who built his injectors. I buzzed them and everything sounds OK on the electrical side and both uvch's are new.

I have a zf6 and AEB3 pcm in an 02. Probably won't work since it needs coolant sensor feedback and some other things to work. Not sure on that though.

Thanks again for the info. I think I am going to check the classifieds on a few forums and see if I can find something that will work just in case.

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Arisley · Oct 27, 2015

No, an '02 PCM will not work on a '00. Wiring is different.

Wiring changed in '01.

ja_cain · Oct 27, 2015

That's pretty much what I thought after doing a little research.

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ja_cain · Oct 27, 2015

Alright guys, a little bit more info. My friend said that everything started after the serpentine belt broke. His brother replaced this and the water pump and everything went to crap. I initially said to check the cps as I thought that maybe it was hit by the broken belt or bumped while replacing the waterpump, but later felt that it wouldn't make it run that bad. I told him to replace it regardless with one from the International dealership up the road but am not sure if that has been done yet. Waiting on him to get back with me with this and a video. Do you guys think it could make it run real rough if it was hit pretty hard and shifted or the spacing/location was significantly changed? I've seen some threads recently about people doing thing with cps's to smooth out a rough running truck. Thanks again for everyone's help.

Arisley · Oct 28, 2015

Have him check the wiring to the CPS. Also the wiring to the ICP sensor. That thing could be running on default ICP.

ja_cain · Oct 28, 2015

Will do. I'll be able to pick up on a faulty icp sensor once I hook Torque Pro up to it and check the injection pressure. I would hate for him to spend $600 on a pcm and it not be the problem.

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TyCorr · Oct 28, 2015

Ive never seen the pcm defaulting to 750psi of icp cause rough idle. Usually a truck that gets to that point was so unmaintained it idles better. You're talking 150-250 psi dependent on your setup.

It could be the problem but im guessing this thing is running really rough.

Honestly I hate pissing around with these anymore so I just send the injectors off. Its not worth troubleshooting and replacing sensors and wiring only to find out an injector or two is puking oil.

Do what thou wilt but were it me.....

ghohouston · Oct 28, 2015

Single shots will idle like a gasser with a larger cam installed on stock super duty split tuning

ja_cain · Oct 28, 2015

TyCorr said:
Ive never seen the pcm defaulting to 750psi of icp cause rough idle. Usually a truck that gets to that point was so unmaintained it idles better. You're talking 150-250 psi dependent on your setup.

It could be the problem but im guessing this thing is running really rough.

Honestly I hate pissing around with these anymore so I just send the injectors off. Its not worth troubleshooting and replacing sensors and wiring only to find out an injector or two is puking oil.

Do what thou wilt but were it me.....

Both the ipr and icp sensor where just replaced. He sent me some videos (pretty low quality) that show it idling steady with the icp sensor unplugged. Once he plugs it back in it reverts to the low loping idle and then to the higher smother idle. Hard to tell how smooth from the video with my ear. If I could see the engine movement in the video I would know if it was rough or not. I told him to come by one evening and I'll check the injection parameters and mess around with it. I suspect if there is issues on the oil side it would either be using a significant amount of oil (smokey too) or there would be oil in the fuel filter. May have him pull that just to make sure.

ja_cain · Oct 28, 2015

Here it is with the icp sensor unplugged.

https://vimeo.com/143920235

Here it is with the sensor plugged back in. Notice how it jumps back up.

https://vimeo.com/143920717

When he has the icp sensor plugged in, I think the idle jumps/hunts along with the loping.

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mandkole · Oct 28, 2015

To me, other than idle rpm, they didn't sound that much different.

If the idle changes dramatically between files, id think it might be a pcm/chip interface issue. However, if its jumping around only with the ICP plugged in , it could be a sensor issue. My .02

ja_cain · Oct 28, 2015

I need to have him do it without chip in. He may have done it that way. I'll find out. I need to get the truck in my possession and then start working on it systematically instead of texting him while on break at work. Frustrating to say the least. Thanks everyone for the help, I really appreciate it.

Jomax · Oct 28, 2015

TyCorr said:
Nvk is the butter if all strategies. Idles great.

tuning pcms of that family will render pmt style tuning though.

And yes if the injectors arent turds it'll idle just fine with the chip unplugged. What pcm is in your truck Justin? You could pull yours and see if it helps his issues. But i wouldnt let him use his chip on your pcm. My nvk4 ran an e99 just fine that we suspected a pcm failure in. In fact he bought a used nvk5 to replace his xle tunes. We were using php and a burner at the time so he just downloaded tunes off bills database for the nvk5 pcm and its been fine since. He said it idles better than ever.

Yup, any of the DPC-422 PCMs Are the best, that's what I have in my E99 and it idles great for 288k on original injectors.

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ja_cain · Oct 29, 2015

Got to check out the truck a little this evening. When he was driving of i coukd hear him getting on it and noticed a fair amount of turbo bark. I haven't been around a lot of these trucks with mods so i wasnt sure if that was normal or not. I had him put it in the 40hp tow tune. At idle it icp was at about 580 and ipr was around 12%. When the idle would jump icp and ipr stayed the same but pw jumped some (can't remember actual value). This would explain higher idle (900 to 1000 rpm). Not sure what might be triggering this. Parking brake light is on because of a broken sensor on the master cylinder. I thought maybe it was just going into high idle mode but that didn't make sense as the eot's were 188. Had him run it up the road and get on it. Truck built 22 lbs of boost. I looked at the ebp and it was up around 34 (48-14). That's when I suspected a faulty/stuck ebpv. That would probably explain the turbo bark when he let off. I took a picture of the valve. I think this is the closed position but will drive my truck tomorrow to confirm the position. What do you guys think. That would explain the lack of power and fuel economy. It is clearly responding to the ts switch as I could tell it was responding to each change in position. I may have home wire it open if he can to see if that fixes his problems.

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TyCorr · Oct 29, 2015

ghohouston said:
Single shots will idle like a gasser with a larger cam installed on stock super duty split tuning

Mine sounds completely normal...

TyCorr · Oct 29, 2015

Turbo bark is normal....its the stock turbo holding on for dear life.

If the icp sensor has been replaced and the pigtail isnt ***ked up you can rule that out.

You need to monitor your perdels. If an injector is ****ting the bed you'll see them adjusting (like pw) to jeep the truck running.

ja_cain · Oct 29, 2015

So you don't think a 12 psi differential is high for 22 pounds of boost on a stock turbo? I'm having him pull the fuel filter to see if there is any oil in it. Unfortunately I cant monitor perdels only cylinder contribution. I guess I can see an AE in my future.