Tuning 101 - Thread Merged with Injector Posts

Charles · May 9, 2016

Strokin572 said:
Just got my new laptop and got Minotaur downloaded trying to make some sense of it, and get my definition files and everything figured out. Truck still isn't even close to being ready, but I was curious to halfway see what's going on in the software.

Just don't make a bunch of changes to a base file on your desk and then think you've concocted the perfect file.

Make sure you start with a base file and make a change at a time once you get in the truck so you see what does what. A lot of it will be counter-intuitive or sometimes flat mislabeled or wrong. Most of it will be spot-on, but you will have to learn how to use it one step at a time.

More than one change at a time is a recipe for frustration and tail-chasing. Avoid that pitfall.

Strokin572 · May 9, 2016

I haven't changed anything yet since I don't even have the pickup running yet. More just trying to get familiar with the tables what means what and everything. I'll do as you said when I get it running and just do small changes until I know exactly what does what. I'm also just trying to get familiar with looking at different files seeing what's different between say a tow tune and a hotter tune.

Charles · May 26, 2016

Well, I took some time to fine tune the program during the hotter weather and to dial in the pw and icp for towing and low rpm lugability with great results. The truck will confidently lug down near 1000rpm while driving around and still have sufficient available power to pull up most hills without issue, while not smoking. In fact, I was running around 22 to 23,000 or so gross and even up some very steep hills I rarely needed more than 1600 or so rpm to have sufficient power with excellent smoke control. On many hills I was running 1400rpm or so pulling that load without issue. On steeper hills required pedal would dictate a downshift and smoke was starting to appear at that rpm but by 1750rpm or so plenty of power was available. The 38R was easily driven deep into surge. Boost was plentiful, even with my leaking driver's exhaust manifold that came to me with a sheared rear bolt.

Anyway, just wanted to keep updated files flowing. This program is reaaaal nice to drive. And it hauls out pretty damn well for a crew cab longbed PMR on stock 4R100.

It's a tow monster. With compounds the potential would be nuts. I plan to see about feeding a thermocouple into the PCS for an EGT reading with the 38R. No smoke, so you imagine it can't be too hot, but then again I've never made this kind of power sub 1700rpm with a single either.

gnxtc2 · May 26, 2016

How much boost were you making down low, what gear were you in and how fast?

Billy T.
[email protected]

mikeeg02 · May 26, 2016

What injectors are in that truck again?

Charles · May 26, 2016

gnxtc2 said:
How much boost were you making down low, what gear were you in and how fast?

Billy T.
[email protected]

I don't have a boost gauge and didn't have the PCS monitor up. Somewhere in this thread I listed boost per rpm previously. It's a little better now, or at least it makes a bit more power per pound of boost because I had to up my trans line a bit at power levels below full power and my trans line is based on boost, so the only way that's possible is if the engine is making more power for a given amount of boost. I've seen this in the past with my red truck and it's a clear indicator of increased efficiency. Gear and speed don't matter, rpm is rpm but I was mainly talking about OD.

Charles · May 26, 2016

mikeeg02 said:
What injectors are in that truck again?

300/200 Hybrid

TyCorr · May 26, 2016

Crazy..

bluedge8 · May 26, 2016

Nice

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ja_cain · May 26, 2016

Awesome stuff Charles. I think I'm going to sneak up to Ty's place and steal his hybrids once he swaps them out for those wimpy 80% nozzle'd A codes. Lol!

The real question is what would be the best single for his current tune? I'm thinking based on his perception of the 38r being deep in surge that the 364.5sxe would be perfect.

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Charles · May 26, 2016

ja_cain said:
Awesome stuff Charles. I think I'm going to sneak up to Ty's place and steal his hybrids once he swaps them out for those wimpy 80% nozzle'd A codes. Lol!

The real question is what would be the best single for his current tune? I'm thinking based on his perception of the 38r being deep in surge that the 364.5sxe would be perfect.

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Depends on whether you wanted to optimize for lugging around, all out towing power or all out power period...

Even when surging hard the 38R makes excellent power and isn't really that loud. It's nothing like a stock turbo chirping and dropping boost and crap. The 38R still does the job of bringing air even when surging at 1700rpm. By about 1800rpm it will pull out. I don't consider it a problem, but if I did, I'd just run one of those machined wheels for the 38R.

Charles · May 26, 2016

I have noticed one drawback to my current setup...

When I get a real douchbag on the road that needs a good old smoke bombing to get their attitude straightened out..... I got nothing... I CANNOT put smoke on somebody since about 4 revisions ago. I can give them a little half second poof, and that's all. Even then I have to let off so it goes into OD, and then stab it hard. If it downshifts too quick I get nothing of value anyway.

Regardless, it only lasts a second or so.

When I have time to work through the boost vs MFD table this program will be stock clean. Hell, better, stock smokes a tad.

ja_cain · May 26, 2016

Charles said:
Depends on whether you wanted to optimize for lugging around, all out towing power or all out power period...

Even when surging hard the 38R makes excellent power and isn't really that loud. It's nothing like a stock turbo chirping and dropping boost and crap. The 38R still does the job of bringing air even when surging at 1700rpm. By about 1800rpm it will pull out. I don't consider it a problem, but if I did, I'd just run one of those machined wheels for the 38R.

All out towing power is my goal. The truck is plenty fast stock with an 80hp GH tune. I drive like an old fart.

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superpsd · May 26, 2016

Nailed down my 350/200 B codes. Very minimal smoke under heavy throttle. Smokeless light to medium throttle. PW is touchy with 200s. Hair too much and you can black out the sun, too little and it turns gutless. Love how it drives now just need to put the 369 on. The idle area of the maps are very little unchanged from even a stock tune. I can run the injectors on a stock tune and the idle is smooth as butter. All I have really done is built off of a canned performance tune and have mostly just adjusted PW and mild adjustments to ICP.

Charles · May 26, 2016

superpsd said:
Nailed down my 350/200 B codes. Very minimal smoke under heavy throttle. Smokeless light to medium throttle. PW is touchy with 200s. Hair too much and you can black out the sun, too little and it turns gutless. Love how it drives now just need to put the 369 on. The idle area of the maps are very little unchanged from even a stock tune. I can run the injectors on a stock tune and the idle is smooth as butter. All I have really done is built off of a canned performance tune and have mostly just adjusted PW and mild adjustments to ICP.

I think a lot of people make a monster out of a mole hill.

Tip..... replace pw with icp and bring the mfd in quicker when you feel the truck dogging down on lack of pw. This is of course assuming the pw is in the ballpark and not totally neutered out.

TyCorr · May 26, 2016

ja_cain said:
Awesome stuff Charles. I think I'm going to sneak up to Ty's place and steal his hybrids once he swaps them out for those wimpy 80% nozzle'd A codes. Lol!

The real question is what would be the best single for his current tune? I'm thinking based on his perception of the 38r being deep in surge that the 364.5sxe would be perfect.

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It would be pretty good on there. Somewhere around 90lbs/min. The 366sxe is right at 100.

Superpsd- with the 369 you'll be able to clean up a lot more fuel. Its going to be waaay more fun to drive.

TyCorr · May 26, 2016

Charles said:
I think a lot of people make a monster out of a mole hill.

Tip..... replace pw with icp and bring the mfd in quicker when you feel the truck dogging down on lack of pw. This is of course assuming the pw is in the ballpark and not totally neutered out.

Id like to see or ride in this thing pulling a grade. My tow tune i have is pretty damn good but some of the shti that bothers me it sounds like you have it nailed down. Which is great.

Im really getting to the point of saying ***k it and getting the software. Cost the same as buying a set of tunes.

superpsd · May 26, 2016

the 369 should be a huge difference. When I finally get a free weekend to start fabricating a mount for it. Hitching up the camper and going camping this weekend maybe next weeknd. Even with the stock turbo it has been fun never been able to bark the tires on shifts on this truck before the sticks.

Charles · May 30, 2016

superpsd said:
the 369 should be a huge difference. When I finally get a free weekend to start fabricating a mount for it. Hitching up the camper and going camping this weekend maybe next weeknd. Even with the stock turbo it has been fun never been able to bark the tires on shifts on this truck before the sticks.

When you can do a 20-30mph roll-on and obliterate the tires for a hundred feet or so, that's when you've made it to the "fun" stage. First time I did a full power roll on with 200 nozzles my red truck came on boost and when the 47 lit off at about 30mph the truck bleeeeeew the tires off to the limiter and stayed there skating down the road until I chopped. A rush came over me and I forever saved 200 nozzles under "***ing awesome" in my mental directory...

I went through a lot of tire that week...

lol.

With the 400/400's at 90-100lbs of boost the red truck would break traction on smooth, dry pavement at 70-90mph. Little dolphin hops.

I'll sell you a GT47-88 if you ever want to take that supercharger off and get serious.

oke:

TyCorr · May 30, 2016

Charles said:
When you can do a 20-30mph roll-on and obliterate the tires for a hundred feet or so, that's when you've made it to the "fun" stage. First time I did a full power roll on with 200 nozzles my red truck came on boost and when the 47 lit off at about 30mph the truck bleeeeeew the tires off to the limiter and stayed there skating down the road until I chopped. A rush came over me and I forever saved 200 nozzles under "***ing awesome" in my mental directory...

I went through a lot of tire that week...

lol.

With the 400/400's at 90-100lbs of boost the red truck would break traction on smooth, dry pavement at 70-90mph. Little dolphin hops.

I'll sell you a GT47-88 if you ever want to take that supercharger off and get serious.

oke:

Jeez...you ever miss that? Or do you want to be able to go out, turn the key, and go on down the road with whatever you can and not have to worry about working on the truck versus working the truck. It seems with what you describe there could be some days where you draw your sanity into question for dailying that setup.