How much fuel is too much?

[lincolnlocker]

many threads available with all the injector flow and how they work... the op asked a question IF his hpop would keep up.. that is all... we dont need another thread derail like we always do when this stuff gets brought up. im guilty of it to but it always reverts to this when inj or hpop gets brought up..


again op, you can run those injectors but the hpop wont hold up to a max hp tune. if thats what your not looking for then by all means it will be fine...

hell even charles is running i believe 400/400 with a old 15° obs hpop but he tunes his own and keeps the pressure at like 2800psi... dont remember his duty cycle but he says its smooth and crisp running... is there room for improvement? yes, a lot! but i think he just did that to prove a point... that it can be done...

live life full throttle

 

[Gearhead]

The 80% nozzle is the cleanest and easiest nozzle to tune out there. It will make 475HP all day long if you have the CC to back it up. There is no reason to run bigger on a truck that makes less than 500 HP. You have operating conditons where the bigger nozzle causes issues with the throttle being an on-off switch. You can't tune around this.

 

[TyCorr]

The 80% nozzle is the cleanest and easiest nozzle to tune out there. It will make 475HP all day long if you have the CC to back it up. There is no reason to run bigger on a truck that makes less than 500 HP. You have operating conditons where the bigger nozzle causes issues with the throttle being an on-off switch. You can't tune around this.

Such as?

I hear what you say and respect it, no.doubt, but (i know, damn skeptics) wouldnt a 200/200 hybrid be the ultimate injector? Enough fuel for a 200% nozzle to make over 500hp yet stupid short pw duration in dd tunes and have a super.cool running street truck?

I know you can tune 200% nozzles.Matt because lots of people.have your tunes for nozzles that size. Why is the 200% not in your good graces? Smoke? Economy?

Would you write tunes for 200/200s?

 

[Powerstroke Cowboy]

Matts first sentence says it all Ty...

 

[TyCorr]

Matts first sentence says it all Ty...

Which begs further clarification. The reasons arent as clear as 80% nozzle tuning.

 

[Gearhead]

i don't care if the injector is a 400cc injector, that has no bearing on how clean it is. the cc is just the capacity of the syringe. you don't have to call for a full "squirt" every time.

 

[TyCorr]

I guess Im missing something. Im going to read more and ask more questions later.

Its hard to decide on injector size when nobody agrees on what does what.

 

[powerstrokenstang]

The stupid short pw as refered to is what causes the on-off problem matt refered too. You have to have a certain amount of pw to get the injector to repond but if it will flow fast the the pw to open alone dumps enough to make it like an on off switch. Lol if that makes no sense matt. Just tell me to shut up.

Imho too much fuel would prob be around 700cc depending in charger setup lol

Also from my experience 80-100% great dd and tow rig. 200% great toy but were gonna try making 200's a tow rig in my buddys truck.

 

[Groomzybanshee]

I have 200s in my tow pig does fine. But like matt said for 475 hp or less why?

 

[Cloverleaffarm]

I have 200s in my tow pig does fine. But like matt said for 475 hp or less why?

how does ur tow rig handle the injectors with the 366? build up to much heat?

 

[TyCorr]

The stupid short pw as refered to is what causes the on-off problem matt refered too. You have to have a certain amount of pw to get the injector to repond but if it will flow fast the the pw to open alone dumps enough to make it like an on off switch. Lol if that makes no sense matt. Just tell me to shut up.

Imho too much fuel would prob be around 700cc depending in charger setup lol

Also from my experience 80-100% great dd and tow rig. 200% great toy but were gonna try making 200's a tow rig in my buddys truck.

Yea, that makes perfect.sense. So.clear I dont know how I missed it.

 

[Groomzybanshee]

how does ur tow rig handle the injectors with the 366? build up to much heat?

I need to update me sig that's old.. The s366 was junk IMO. My 71/76 bb Garrett spools/ pulls circles around what the 366 did.

 

[CurtisF]

I have 200s in my tow pig does fine. But like matt said for 475 hp or less why?

With the injectors in my sig, I can tow with far more power and simultaneously far less EGT's than smaller nozzles.

I've also fixed the issue of a harsh on-off pedal. My tunes feel bone stock coming off idle.

Granted it took me a while to figure it out, mainly because I'm a novice tuner and I don't have near the experience of pro tuners. Matt did provide me with some assistance BTW. So did Tony and Bill. These guys all rock IMO.

 

[Cloverleaffarm]

I need to update me sig that's old.. The s366 was junk IMO. My 71/76 bb Garrett spools/ pulls circles around what the 366 did.

if you add a gate/billet wheel could it survive a set of 250s without gernading itself? or have to much drive pressure?

 

[Chvyrkr]

Another thing to note...

IIRC 80 and 200% nozzles are honed the same way. The 100% has a rougher finishin process.

As I understand it this is why the 80% is such a dream to tune, and why the 200% is a better option than a 100% for those that have the time to tune out the touchy pedal.

 

[Groomzybanshee]

With the injectors in my sig, I can tow with far more power and simultaneously far less EGT's than smaller nozzles.

I've also fixed the issue of a harsh on-off pedal. My tunes feel bone stock coming off idle.

Granted it took me a while to figure it out, mainly because I'm a novice tuner and I don't have near the experience of pro tuners. Matt did provide me with some assistance BTW. So did Tony and Bill. These guys all rock IMO.

Yes but not every body has the ability to tune like you!!

My 250/200s- 350/200s and 650/400s never had the on off throttle problem. That is with pmt platform.

 

[TyCorr]

Another thing to note...

IIRC 80 and 200% nozzles are honed the same way. The 100% has a rougher finishin process.

As I understand it this is why the 80% is such a dream to tune, and why the 200% is a better option than a 100% for those that have the time to tune out the touchy pedal.

Yes, 30,80,200, and 400 are unmolested nozzles. Well a stocker obviously too.

100 has rough edges from the machining from 80 to 100ish. Affects the results of.tuning.

 

[907DAVE]

650/400? Do tell!

 

[Groomzybanshee]

650/400? Do tell!

They didn't work....

 

[TARM]

What Mat is talking about is things like when your cruise control is set say at 55-60mph. The larger nozzle has less resolution. Its a combo of the nozzle and low boost falt ground low very light load. Same thing with very light throttle change. If you get your foot just right where you are holding a lower speed say 55-60 on flat ground then see just how small amount of throttle you can give. Rather than this smooth felling you will feel it flip on a very light surge I guess you can describe it as. If you get play with it you can get it to go on off on off etc. THe cruise control does it more so as on flat ground it tries to hold a precise speed and that's when you can fell it. If you do not use cruise much if at all then its not a big deal. To most guys on here I doubt care about that or would notice it when it really dialed in but there are people that are quite particular and stuff that like irritate them as they expect stock like quality. You can imagine how picky some people are. Also when you consider that 95% of all tunes are remote not live tuned. Honestly I really doubt most on here would even notice it unless told to try and feel it and make it happen but there are people out there like that trust me.

Matt does a dam good job (best I have tried)including his remote canned tunes. He got my 200s dialed in very nicely. But I can say when I had him play with my pedal crispness (sensitivity) that on off thing could really be felt. There is a happy medium between pedal crispness and pleasurable drivability. I actually keep two different tunes. One I use for long travel which has less crisp pedal and one with a bit crisper pedal. But that's just me if I did not know the difference either would be fine. Its just a slight change. Nothing like what you get in some race tunes where they jack up so much the truck lurches forward with the least amount of throttle input. I hate that crap.


But if you have no reason to ever need a 200% whats the point really. The 80% is a cleaner nozzle as its EDM with no honing from what I recall. Where a 100% is a 80% with honing to 100%. That is unless things have changed which they certainly could have over the years. Hence the 80% should be a cleaner nozzle. Much like a 200% is cleaner than a 300% as its a 200% honed to 300%. Honestly unless you are going to tear into the inside of your engine or do not mind the unscheduled occasional engine swap a turbo in the 38r/H2 etc with 238/80% can get you lots of fun power and a good chance of a long lasting engine. Go past that 500hp and reliability start to decrease rapidly unless you start beefing up the bottom end unless you take it easy. But if you do that then what was the point of the extra power in the first place.