250/200 vs 238/100

[FrankTheTank]

Found a smoking deal on 250/200s so I picked them up. I had it in my mind that the largest I wanted to go was 238/100s and starting to have second thoughts. I'm not looking to do block fills, griddles, ect.... I will be running a stock bottom end with studs,springs, and p/r's up top. My question is reliability, tuning ability, cold starts, and not blowing my bottom end out on 200% nozzles. I still need to use the truck for a truck and drive to and from work.

Should I trade up and go smaller or should I just stick with what I have and go with it. I'm gonna call Matt at Gearhead this week and talk to him also

Any input would be great

 

[JD3020]

Here's my $.02

I currently have 250/2's, stock HPOP, non intercooled, and a D66(soon be going back to stock then to T4 later on). I tune my truck myself, so i have the ability to make any tweaks needed to fit my set-up. For example ICP peaks and holds at 2950psi, at 48% DC. I tow decent loads(entire GVW around the 19-20k range). It runs extremely clean, a haze at most under heavy acceleration, and makes good power. Cold starts are fine, better than 99% of the 7.3's out there. I also race and pull it a good bit when its warm, and for a mostly stock truck it runs fairly strong.


BUT, i came from 175/100%'s and again towed with them. Overall for a truck that is strictly a truck, i liked the 100%'s the best. They were a little more forgiving when it came to getting hot/smokey. My truck made less power with them, but it was more fun because i wasn't worried about blowing everything to hell.

If i ever build another truck that isn't going to be a racer and puller like mine is, i'd go with a 238/80%.

 

[smoker00]

You can make a 250\200. Run the same as a 238\100..no problem. .just on your all out tune the 250 with and the right soporting mods will make more power..
Its all in the tune..

Keep them...

 

[DZL JIM]

You'll like the 100% nozzles better for towing and working the truck.
Otherwise, if you keep the 200% nozzles, make an appointment somewhere for live tuning. Those nozzles are fussy and pretty much need live tuning IMO.

 

[FrankTheTank]

I knew you could detune them, but wasn't sure to what extent. Kinda like buying 400s and trying to detune them to run like 160s, lol.

I will just continues build as if I was building it smaller and if I decide to go all out, I can later!

 

[FrankTheTank]

You'll like the 100% nozzles better for towing and working the truck.
Otherwise, if you keep the 200% nozzles, make an appointment somewhere for live tuning. Those nozzles are fussy and pretty much need live tuning IMO.

That's what I was afraid of. I know tuning a 100%. Nozzle is very effective to tune any way u want even back to stock. These are actually your injectors and was gonna give I a call to price out a re-nozzle to 100%

 

[JD3020]

They can definitely be de-tuned to work. Hell i've got no clue what i'm doing but i've made my truck run extremely well. LOL

 

[bruce]

This is 2014, tunin a 200% nozzle to be clean and ready for work should be a non issue. Too many of us runnin them for them to be problematic.

 

[mandkole]

The 100s will be less of a headache... at part throttle, lower/mid ICP, tip-in conditions I'll take the 100 any day. If I was competing more, or more concerned about getting all of the fuel at max effort, Id put the work into the 200s.

 

[David N]

I went from 250/100's to 250/200's, and I honestly could not tell a difference. Other than the truck does make more power now. But I also had a PMR motor before, and they were detuned a bit.

 

[FrankTheTank]

Thanks for all the info but it seems like the 200% may just be more then I want. Was lookin for a clean, crisp, 500-525hp that is a good daily driver with no "dead spots".

 

[CurtisF]

Thanks for all the info but it seems like the 200% may just be more then I want. Was lookin for a clean, crisp, 500-525hp that is a good daily driver with no "dead spots".

250/200's will easily get you there.

From my own experience yes they are generally more difficult to dial in. However, I have run into trucks with 238/100's that just wouldn't cooperate either.

On the flip side though, if your tunes are set up properly to control fueling and timing, you can have more useable power to tow with 250/200's than you will with smaller sticks. You can also have stock-like manners if you want, and better power in the 500+ range. Being a novice tuner, the only thing I haven't really figured out all that well is idle quality. Mine idles like an OBS with a slight chop at times. It's not horrible, just something that bugs me a little mainly because I can't quite figure it out.

If you already have the sticks, toss them in and try them. Tuning is key to your happiness with them.

 

[FrankTheTank]

Is the towing more useable with the 200% because it dumps fuel and burns completely while the 100% creates a funnel effect "like poring gas on a fire" where it cannot dump fuel fast enough to burn completely to keep egt's down

 

[mandkole]

Since you already have them, it wouldnt hurt to stab them in, setup some tuning and try them out. Getting good use from 200s really depends on what you want (performance vs. working the truck). If it were me, Id create a couple of tow files and see if you are going to like them with a good load back there.

 

[CurtisF]

Is the towing more useable with the 200% because it dumps fuel and burns completely while the 100% creates a funnel effect "like poring gas on a fire" where it cannot dump fuel fast enough to burn completely to keep egt's down

It's a matter of fuel vs time.

As RPM's climb, you have a ever shrinking injection window. Smaller nozzles can't push fuel out fast enough, so you either 1) cut pulse width, or 2) end up with smoke and EGT's trying to squeeze out all the fuel.

Now with 100% nozzles, you aren't really going to have that much of an issue say if you're towing since you won't be running these injectors at full tilt. So it's kind of a moot point there.

But if you're going for more play-time power, say that 500+ hp mark, those bigger nozzles will allow you to flow more fuel in a shorter amount of time, giving you that added power at higher RPM, while keeping EGT's lower than trying to make the same power with smaller nozzles.

Anything else, such as drivability, smoke, keeping your motor intact, etc will all rely heavily on your tuner. But then again, the EXACT same thing applies if you were running 238/100's. It's just typically a bit more difficult to dial in the 200% nozzles. If you have a little bit of patience for that, then it won't be a problem. If you live close to a tuner, then a live tuning session would really be beneficial.

 

[powerlifter405]

Use the 200's and call Swamps.

 

[FrankTheTank]

Thanks for the explaintion on the nozzles vs p/w vs timing. Makes perfect sense

I live 5 minutes from Eric at innovative but he doesn't do much for a 7.3.

I don't like swamps tunning but for racing and sledding and such which is where the hydra would be great

I was gonna give Gearhead a try to also try out his transmission shifting.

 

[PSD POWER007]

Thanks for the explaintion on the nozzles vs p/w vs timing. Makes perfect sense

I live 5 minutes from Eric at innovative but he doesn't do much for a 7.3.

I don't like swamps tunning but for racing and sledding and such which is where the hydra would be great

I was gonna give Gearhead a try to also try out his transmission shifting.

At one time, Eric had a 7.3 Excursion of his own. I wouldn't cut him short...

 

[FrankTheTank]

I did not know that! ^^^. I think you all have decided to make me keep my 200s. Now to start talking to tuners

 

[Strokersace]

I've towed heavy with 200's for over 60,000 miles in the past couple of years. All in tuning. No issues. Only way I'd go back to a 100% is if I had a truck that was never a play toy and was only ever hauling the stock trailer or feeding cows.