Front End Help

[Rob D]

Hi Guys,

Bought a 2001 F350 CCSB ZF6 4x4 - sold the 03 white one a few weeks back. This truck is a complete creme puff - bone stock 178k miles from west coast, no rust etc.

Bought truck with known bad passenger side ball joints. Tackled the job myself last weekend. Steering knuckle upon re-assembly was extremely tough to turn side to side by hand. Followed proper torque sequence, although final torque on lower was by hand as I did not have a toque wrench at my disposal that went up to 150 ft-lbs. Lower to 35-40, top to 69, lower to "ya thats about 150" lol. I know this is not as by the books as some guys like to see it, but anyway - the knuckle was tight as hell before final torque on the lower - torquing all the way did not seem to make it any worse. I broke her free and attempted torque sequence again with same result - so decided the hell with it, maybe they just need break in time. I put it back together and when finished it does not seem to have any problems. Power steering pump was already whining so I think it is on the way out - but it whines louder now.

Questions are:

1 - Is it normal for the knuckle to be hard to turn by hand with new BJs? I am worried I may have pressed the upper in too far as it is only supposed to be flush, but I ended up with maybe 1/8" proud. Didn't want to press it back out flush so left alone.

2 - When braking 'hard' - truck pulls hard to one side. Driver side ball joints have already been replaced at some point in the past as they have zerk fittings and stock does not, and it tested fine when I inspected so I have left that side alone. Truck drives straight, does have a very slight pull, but returns to center fine as well. Could new BJs on one side cause this to happen?

3 - The axle seal was in fine condition, but a piece/ring of it on the back side of the seal in front of the U-joint was just hanging there. I read this is pretty normal, so I just put the axle back in as the main seal was fine, and I will probably end up just going with manual WARN hubs anyway. Dust seal was also in rough shape. Didn't have these parts - nor the special tool to set so just put back together - is this going to cause any major problems?

4 - Truck has ESOF auto locking stock hubs. Passenger side was frozen locked. I took apart hub, cleaned, re-packed and put back together. No luck, but at least it is not locked now. I took driver side off to service at same time, and noticed the following: The thrust washer, hex washer, and thrust washer with c-clip holding on the axle spline inside the hub assembly on the passenger side are tight, they do not free spin. On the driver side all washers are loose and can be spun by hand. Is this a problem? Also oddly enough the passenger auto hub bearing free spins in the lock position and is locked in the free position - is there anyway to cause reverse operation when re-packing?? Drivers side hub would lock to the axle when manually set to lock, but when I put back to auto it would not unlock - this is while up on jack stands - so I am assuming driver side is junk too?

5 - Still have a front end clunk noise and can not for the life of me figure out what it is. I have checked to the best of my ability the ball joints, tie-rod ends, sway bar link ends and cannot find any play. Steering feels tight too and is not bouncing all over the place in my hand over bumps. Strange part is I hear the clunking over very slight bump in the road, in cab when windows are up and radio is off. At a loss. Any ideas greatly appreciated!

Thanks guys

 

[mikeeg02]

Did you try greasing them? Or are they non greasable?

My uncle had a set of ball joints on his excursion that were hard to turn the knuckle by hand, (steering linkage disconnected) and he had serious steering wander afterwards to the point he replaced his box and every other component in the steering linkage, only to find out afterwards the ball joints were stiff/ not any good.

From your description in question 2, it sounds like you dont have steering wander, and they may just of been stiff from being brand new.

If the truck pulls hard to one side, its likely your caliper on the OPPOSITE side is sticking, or even more likely the slides are sticking on that side, not allowing the brake pads to compress the rotor. In this scenario the pad on the piston side of the caliper will be worn harder then the other side. The slides are more likely to be the culprit if the truck returns to center and tracks straight without the brake pedal applied, but the caliper can still be the culprit too. Again on the opposite side that its pulling to.

Hubs are fun, if you had it locked, and switch to unlocked, typically you have to spin the wheel opposite of whatever way you were spinning it while locked, to unlock them. They dont typically just unlock.

On the clunk, remove the sway bar and go for a ride. If the problem goes away, replace ALL the bushings, axle included. If it doesnt you may actually need leaf spring eye bushings.

 

[Rob D]

Mike - thanks for the reply.

- Joints are all greasable and were greased
- Didn't think it would be brakes as I had no issues with this before I replaced ball joints but I will check them out. Can rear brakes also cause pulling?
- Hubs - I spun the wheel both directions multiple rotations and they did not un-lock, but maybe just didn't spin around enough to get them to unlock?
- the sway bar link ends are brand new - I will check leaf spring bushings - thanks!

 

[mikeeg02]

I would still look very closely at the opposite side its pulling. Which side did you do the ball joints on? The side its pulling to? The rears will pull, but it is typically much less dramatic. It would be a good idea to make sure all the slide pins in fact, slide.

The hubs should typically disengage with very minor reverse turning. It sounds like its time for a set of hubs.

The end links are not the only thing that clunks when you hit bumps. It can also clunk on the rubber bushings actually on the axle. But to eliminate it completely, remove the sway bar entirely, and drive it. The spring eye bushings could be the culprit, but you need to be 100% sure on the sway bar. (Which is also the easiest to do)

 

[Rob D]

Thanks - will do!

 

[mikeeg02]

Be sure to update us on what you find. It's always helpful for other people when searching for similar problems to see the resolution.

 

[Rob D]

Always try to end my help threads out with what the fixes were bud - been around these forums for a long time and have had a lot of help from all the good guys on here. Nothing more annoying when your a guy like myself with nobody around to lend a hand who knows more and you find the exact problem you have in a thread and the OP never closes out what the solution was!

 

[benjamindurtka]

The seals on the end of the axle shaft can allow enough play for some clunking. But you would be able to grab them by hand and lift/shake/drop them to imitate the noise you're hearing.
The steering knuckle should turn pretty freely.
When I did ball joints on my 2001 the axle shafts were clunking and all of my seals were shot and the hubs were worn out. new hubs, seals and ball joints is what fixed mine. I was careful to get the ball joints at the correct depth.
Seems like you know what your doing though. Just my experience. Good luck.

2001 F-250 cclb
7.3l 4x4
forged rods,
ebpv, muffler, dp80hp dd.

 

[Rob D]

Ben -

Seal looked good and fit nice and snug, no play so I do not think that is the problem. Hubs spin nice and freely with no noises or anything.

I am trying to rack my brain and figure out if I ever had to "brake" hard with the truck prior to doing the ball joints. I had very minimal seat time before repairing so maybe the truck would have pulled before too which would lend to the brakes.

Thanks for the input though - I will post back with what I find.

 

[03_PSD]

I'm in the same boat as you with the annoying clicking over any size bump. I'm going to remove my sway bar and see what it does.

 

[lightning95]

Same here. Just replaced all the bj's with Moog and it still pops on turns. Next is an Energy Suspension bushing kit. Looks like it's gonna be a pain to do. The rubber in the leafs is all cracked and mangled.
Keep us posted!

 

[03_PSD]

Found my clicking. Took off my sway bar but clicking remained. Turned out to be passenger side upper shock bushing was deteriorating just enough for some metal on metal action. Bilstein 5100's are in bound!

 

[Rob D]

I am still in the process of diagnosing. Even though the driver side felt fine by trying to move the wheel/tire - I decided to take apart the hub assembly for inspection.

Axle seal was in rough shape so I pulled the shaft and took the seal off. Decided I would do passenger side while in there just for ease of maintenance log. Dust seals I know will just fail again but the amount of crud in the axle housing was enough for me to want to replace both of those as well anyways. Needle bearings in both hub assemblies look fine. Main hub bearing spins free with no nasty noises so I will just be re-using those with the new yellow o-ring.

As far as brakes go: slide pins on driver side caliper are fine - forgot to check passenger side, will do that when I go back to re-assemble.

Did not end up taking off the sway bar as I decided to finish servicing the seals and do the job 100% correct before moving on.

Good note was the passenger ball joints I just installed which made the knuckle very difficult to turn - had already loosened up quite a bit with only maybe 100 miles on the install, so I am not longer worried about that!

Will keep everyone posted as to what I find.

 

[Rob D]

Update:

Passenger side brake was getting bound up on the caliper pins which was the problem for my truck pulling to the side. Took them apart, sanded and regreased pins and slides, now no more pulling :clapping:

Front end noise ended up being a loose sway bar link end. Even though they were literally brand new on the truck when I bought it - prior owner must have had one too many while installing. I had passed over them when looking for the noise initially because I knew they were brand new and assumed they would have been installed correctly seeing as how the owner before me was a heavy equipment mechanic...should not assume anything. For those shade tree mechanics like myself looking to try and diagnose yourself, make sure you push the truck side to side, not just up and down when trying to replicate noises :doh:

I also up-graded my ESOF vacuum line to Dieselsite's braided stainless mesh ones as well. Extremely simple install and they should hold up much better up here in the northeast. Only note for others is that you will need a couple inches of hose to make the connection between the nipple up in the inner fender where you disconnect, to the new stainless lines. If your upgrading for preventive maintenance and the hose on your truck is in good shape, you could just cut a couple pieces from them and re-use. On mine, the whole length of hose was junk so I needed to buy new hosing - it was 3/16". I used zip ties around each fitting for some added security, as well as around the brake lines, as the aftermarket stainless lines cannot be re-fed through the plastic clips.

http://www.dieselsite.com/1999-2004f250f350dieselsite4wdesofhosekit.aspx

4x4 system now works fine with all the new seals. I greased all bearings/needling bearings while having everything apart. I found out you can get grease into the main wheel bearing which is considered non-serviceable from ford by squirting some in through the ABS sensor hole. I did order the special tool for setting the axle seals - OTC part no. 6695. Do not be intimidated, getting the seal on was easy, in fact beating the old seals off was harder than installing the new ones! I put brand new Ford auto locking hubs on as well. Learned my lessons in the past waiting for bad weather to find out I had 4x4 problems, best to get ahead of it while its nice weather to wrench in.

Lastly my 4x4 dash light would not illuminate, but the truck was mechanically engaged. Ended up being a bad bulb, even though I just replaced every single one less than a month ago. Nice pointer for others is that the 4x4 light should come on KOEO, if it doesn't its a burnt bulb. I knew mine was fine because I tested it while on jack stands, as well as I could hear the t-case actuator when selecting 4Hi and 4Low.

Thanks for the help and pointers gents.