Hard start when cold NOT glow plug related

Jomax · Dec 17, 2015

Truck is a late 99. 160k miles

New hpop
New IPR and pigtail
New ICP and pigtail
New ford alternator
New Ford Batteries

Injectors were changed with swamps stock injectors 30k miles ago. A shop did this for the owner. I am not 100% sure if they changed them or just ripped her off, because these issues point to injectors
Glow plugs are good along with the relay.

Once the truck is up to temp, it runs perfect, starts perfect.

Yesterday oil temp was 38 degrees.

It will crank for awhile, start, then romp really bad then die. This needs to be done about 5 times till it finally stays running.

ICP jumped to 1500psi while cranking and IPR was at 40%

Could it be injector o rings? The actual injectors?

Thinking if arch oil could help?

Thanks

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sootie · Dec 17, 2015

sounds like good old stiction

jaybuller · Dec 17, 2015

How is the blowby out of the oil fill tube at idle? Does it haze at cold start? Does it haze blue once running? I'd say either low or lost compression in one or more cyl or just bad injectors.... I've been down the cold start problem road with 2 of my 7.3 trucks. One turned out to be melted piston ring land lowering the compression causing the issue just as you described and then my current truck that did not have any issues at all until I bought rebuilt 160/30 injectors. The new injectors on my truck caused the issue due to armetuere clearance. (I've been deployed a loooot the last two years so I haven't been able to resolve the issue yet but this winter I think I'll be able to get the injectors out and sent in to be redone

mandkole · Dec 17, 2015

Id think it should build more ICP than 1500-- with tired GPs, started my truck with 35 deg oil temp last week.. It was cranky and smoky but the ICP was at almost 3K when it lit.

Jomax · Dec 17, 2015

jaybuller said:
How is the blowby out of the oil fill tube at idle? Does it haze at cold start? Does it haze blue once running? I'd say either low or lost compression in one or more cyl or just bad injectors.... I've been down the cold start problem road with 2 of my 7.3 trucks. One turned out to be melted piston ring land lowering the compression causing the issue just as you described and then my current truck that did not have any issues at all until I bought rebuilt 160/30 injectors. The new injectors on my truck caused the issue due to armetuere clearance. (I've been deployed a loooot the last two years so I haven't been able to resolve the issue yet but this winter I think I'll be able to get the injectors out and sent in to be redone

Blow by is normal, no smoke out the tail pipe once started, nor is there any while cranking. Thing runs GOOD in the 60T tune(all it has). No blue smoke or white smoke.

Sad thing is it got injectors installed 30k miles ago She bought them from swamps, gave it to the shop, and the shop gave her old injectors to return. But you never know.....

mandkole said:
Id think it should build more ICP than 1500-- with tired GPs, started my truck with 35 deg oil temp last week.. It was cranky and smoky but the ICP was at almost 3K when it lit.

1500 but it went up to 2100 if I kept cranking .

At this. Point I'm leaning towards injectors... Or O-rings. But isn't orings usually a issue when it doesn't start warm? Or doesn't start at all?

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Jomax · Dec 17, 2015

sootie said:
sounds like good old stiction

Going to Order some arch oil and try my luck. Seems to be better then hot shot secret.

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TyCorr · Dec 17, 2015

Sounds like a bad bank of injectors or an ipr not working correctly.

DEEZUZ · Dec 17, 2015

I would do buzz test dead cold. On 7.3s I do up to 30 in a row. If they get significantly better then we know our issue.

You never know, maybe fuel pressure was an issue and it took these new injectors out, premature wear. 7.3 will pull fuel from the tank for thousands of miles until the injectors are just so worn we run into this issue

6.0 Tech · Dec 17, 2015

Does it run right if its plugged in?

Jomax · Dec 17, 2015

TyCorr said:
Sounds like a bad bank of injectors or an ipr not working correctly.

IPR is brand new, did this before that. IPR was changed just for preventive maintenance. She had the HPOP leaking and decided to install new parts.

CTC DEEZUL said:
I would do buzz test dead cold. On 7.3s I do up to 30 in a row. If they get significantly better then we know our issue.

You never know, maybe fuel pressure was an issue and it took these new injectors out, premature wear. 7.3 will pull fuel from the tank for thousands of miles until the injectors are just so worn we run into this issue

I did the buzz test cold and they sounded even and did it three times. I'll try it 30times

Question how does doing it 30 times help really?

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Jomax · Dec 17, 2015

6.0 Tech said:
Does it run right if its plugged in?

I did not try that. I will have her plug it in and see. Going from what it does. I'm fairly certain it will start plugged in, it starts like a brand new truck when warm.

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79jasper · Dec 17, 2015

Isn't that a symptom of bad injectors though?

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Jomax · Dec 17, 2015

79jasper said:
Isn't that a symptom of bad injectors though?

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Seems to be, but supposedly has new injectors from swamps, first thing I need to do is open the valve covers, and see if swamps keeps track of their injectors off of the solenoid part number. And see if that shop did indeed change the injectors.

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DEEZUZ · Dec 17, 2015

Well stiction being an issue is being tossed around in here. Multiple buzz tests free up the armatures. Like said, if I have one that doesn't fire when cold, and I know it's not a fuel side issue, I buzz test several times and once they all buzz strong I can turn key and she'll fire up.

Now if we're unclear if this is a fuel side issue then you can remove the fuel filter, drain the base, fill it full of Stanadyne Performance formula and start her up. It should be night and day difference within a minute or so. This basically frees up nozzles immediately and they atomize 10 times better, until the Stanadyne runs out...

TyCorr · Dec 17, 2015

Jomax said:
Seems to be, but supposedly has new injectors from swamps, first thing I need to do is open the valve covers, and see if swamps keeps track of their injectors off of the solenoid part number. And see if that shop did indeed change the injectors.

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They do. Ive had injectors 10+ years old still be in their inj database.