Hot retorque needed?

[GreenF350]

Getting ready to do ARP head studs this weekend. (Truck is already partially torn down) and have been reading all the head stud threads I can find. A bunch of them talk about hot retorques. I have two questions on that....First, is it really necessary? I've never done a hot retorque on a gas motor before (or at least not as I understand it) and two, how do you guys that do that hot retorque do it? Do you pull injectors again for the retorque and then put new orings/copper washers on them? If it needs done, it needs done, but seems like a heck of a lot of work for not a lot of return to me. It's probably a dumb question, but I have been waiting a long time to be putting these mods on the truck. Expect a few more dumb questions/post in the next week or so from me as I work to do valve springs, push rods, glow plugs, head studs, and injectors. Thanks guys.
-Aaron

 

[V-Ref]

I'd call Unlimited Diesel, Swamps, Empire, Driven or any other reputable shop that builds/raced a 7.3 and ask. I think the re-torques are more critical on a "new" block/head surface vs. one that has had several thousand heat cycles to "settle" in.

I installed studs/springs/pushrods, then ran the truck for a while on stock injs, and then did a retorque after installing hybrid injectors....so it wasn't "extra" work per say for me.

Air tools and a Top Side Creeper make working on our trucks a bit easier, if you can swing access to those.

I installed mine by the numbers, and did several re-torques, but still lifted a head after a stud failed....so I'm not sure there's a fool proof method. Prob still better be safe then sorry and retorque 'em IMO.

Be sure your wrench is calibrated, use ARP assembly lube, use a M12x1.75 bottoming tap & WD40/shop air to clean out the holes, and follow the torque sequence....I think all will agree on those procedures.

 

[Rideracelivemx7]

I didn't retorque my heads the first time with my new heads. when I pulled the motor back out about a year later I found out I had loose studs. be lucky if they even had 100lbs on them. I retorqued mine with the new motor as a 3 or 4 lost torque after about 4 or 5 heat cycles.

 

[V-Ref]

This follows my experience as well.

Hot retorque #1 was after about 30 days/1500 miles of driving, and was in conjunction with installing Hybrid injs.

Hot retorque #2 was after another 30 days/1500 miles of driving, and was 'cause I needed to pull the new Hybrids out to have 'em looked at.

Hot retorque #3 was after about 60 days/3000 miles of driving, and I decided to replace the UVCHs chasing an rompy idle issue.

Hot retorque #4 was after almost a year and 10000 miles of driving, as I decided to swap out turbo mount/turbo setup, and just did it to to do it.

Each time I got fasteners to turn a 1/8 to a 1/4 turn (some on retorque #1 & #2 took up to a half a turn)....but as the re-torques progressed....definitely less fasteners needed less and less turns to get the TQ wrench to crack.

I'm going to do it twice (one initial, and then one after 30 days of DD) and call it done in the future.

 

[GreenF350]

Dang. That kind of sucks, but yeah. Better to do it right for sure. I have air tools and a topside creeper here at the house so I'm good to go there. So when you guys do the retorque, are you just checking the torque on them or loosening them and retightening to spec? I would assume the the former?
-Aaron

 

[V-Ref]

Dang. That kind of sucks, but yeah. Better to do it right for sure. I have air tools and a topside creeper here at the house so I'm good to go there.

I don't know how to work without this stuff now :thumbsup:

So when you guys do the retorque, are you just checking the torque on them or loosening them and retightening to spec? I would assume the the former?
-Aaron

Yep...on re-torques...it's just one torque step to your peak target torque...don't loosen 'em. That's what the smart guys at the shops I posted above told me as well...

 

[CSIPSD]

Never re-TQed any of my studs... Green motor, Blue motor or yellow motor...

ARP's...

 

[Rideracelivemx7]

more of a preventative maintenance I guess, if I knew some of my head studs were THAT loose when I was pushing my old set up I would have acting considered a retorque. now that I stepped it up a bit ill be more religious about hot retorques.

 

[02BigD]

Little different because my 02 has fire rings, but 60k + miles on 1 hot retorque that was performed on the stand when the engine was first assembled. H11's.

 

[co04cobra]

Is it a new build? or are you doing them one at a time?

I've never hot-retorqued the several I have put together on "seasoned" gaskets. The older H11s seemed to be the ones that needed that the most.

Also, ARPs special lube is suppose to eliminate the need for re-torques.

 

[GreenF350]

It's just a one for one swap out on seasoned gaskets. 265,000 miles and 13 years worth of seasoning to be exact. I'm leaning towards extra care in the torque of them and might even let them sit overnight and check again, but I'm thinking I'm going to skip the hot retorque. Anyone think I'm completely stupid? (Well, for that plan anyway.)
-Aaron

 

[CSIPSD]

I would install them, tq them to spec and throw the motor in...

Has not failed me yet.

 

[drunk on diesel]

I still don't understand the whole hot torque thing.

ARP torque specs are cold torque specs. I have no problem with retorques, but I don't get the hot thing. Why not just up the cold torque spec if you want more clamping force?

there's a recent post on one of the forums where a guy snapped a stud after a bunch of hot retorques

 

[V-Ref]

I still don't understand the whole hot torque thing.

ARP torque specs are cold torque specs. I have no problem with retorques, but I don't get the hot thing. Why not just up the cold torque spec if you want more clamping force?

there's a recent post on one of the forums where a guy snapped a stud after a bunch of hot retorques

Drunk

Can you get me in touch with this guy?

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[CGMKCM]

LOL

 

[earlybroncoboy]

Could be totally off on this but I think it is letting the engine go through a few heat cycles then checking the torque. I just checked the torque on mine when I put the 300/200s in. Needless to say every one took some more.

May not be needed. Just thought I would check mine since I was in there.

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[gnxtc2]

With the new ARP Ultra Torque lube, you don't have to torque cycle the studs. With the old ARP stuff, yes.

When you guys are retorque the studs, are backing off the nuts and then torquing? Or are you just torquing right to spec?

If you want to re-torque the studs, the proper way is to back them off and then to final torque.

Billy T.
[email protected]

 

[V-Ref]

1. Use ARP Ultra Torque lube.
2. Ensure your torque wrench is calibrated.
3. Use the right sequence and increase to target torque in the recommended steps
4. If you decide to do hot retorques....loosen the fastener..reapply lube then retorque.

I did #1, #2, and #3...but didn't do #4

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[Arisley]

I installed my studs, torqued them to specs. A few heat cycles later, hit the ones I could get to with a wrench, not a one of them moved. Called it good.