Missed a shift

[Jason]

^^^This guy FTW!!

Exactly, given the mentality of this thread, I couldn't help but throw another spin on this "heated debate" lmao.

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

Sounds to me it learns a shift table at say 1/4 throttle to keep shifts at .400 seconds and it learns another at full throttle to keep shifts at .400 seconds, just my understanding right or wrong it is what it is.

That's how it works.

 

[BlueOvalDiesel]

My thinking is if you are accelerating harder it has to adapt to get the desired time though. If its not adapting to the way you drive whats it adapting to other than if we change tuning. That's the real question. Not trying to be a dick just tell us what it is adapting to to get the desired shifts. Why would it need to adapt if everything else in the system remains constant?

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

If you have a different power setting everything is NOT remaining constant. Engine torque is a MAJOR input to the required pressure for a shift.

Adaptive software was developed to make the trans more consistent. The are variations in each truck, engine, and transmission, and that affects the shifts. By adapting to the variations and making each shift at it's ideal slip time the trans will be more consistent. Also, shift time tend to get longer as the trans wears. Adaptive eliminates this.

As I have said repeatedly it adapts to the shift time from when the computer commands the shift until the shift has ended. There is a large table for each shift. If you drive at low throttle the low throttle part of the table will adapt. The higher throttle part will remain at the default pressures until you drive at higher throttle.

 

[snafu]

Mark will you shed some light on the trans going into neutral while spinning the tires. Under what conditions is the 5r programmed to go into neutral?

 

[swinky]

Mark will you shed some light on the trans going into neutral while spinning the tires. Under what conditions is the 5r programmed to go into neutral?

Never heard of this or had it happen. Many burnouts and never went into neutral.

Sent from my SM-T210R using Tapatalk

 

[pipeliner]

It has happened to me. Doing a burn out at the track to warm the tires up. It spun the tire then bounced off rev limiter i let off then it slammed into gear hard. Deff. Didnt try to make that pass. Loaded the truck up went home sad lol

 

[slc dzl]

It has happened to me. Doing a burn out at the track to warm the tires up. It spun the tire then bounced off rev limiter i let off then it slammed into gear hard. Deff. Didnt try to make that pass. Loaded the truck up went home sad lol

Off subject but whose big oil are you using?

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

Mark will you shed some light on the trans going into neutral while spinning the tires. Under what conditions is the 5r programmed to go into neutral?

It is not programmed to go to neutral unless the shift handle is moved to N.

 

[BlueOvalDiesel]

My truck missed a shift and did not try to go back into gear until it settled down. I figured it was so it wouldn't hurt itself. Mine spun then hooked and right after it hooked it tried to shift.

 

[snafu]

It is not programmed to go to neutral unless the shift handle is moved to N.

Maybe neutral wasn't the best choice of words, I have seen several different trucks kick out of gear while spinning and trying to shift even on stock tuning.

I believe what you say over pretty much anyone else when it comes to the 5r but I have been told by a trans builder the trans will kick out of gear while spinning to protect itself. Is there any merit to this or is it in fact a shift flare?

My truck missed a shift and did not try to go back into gear until it settled down. I figured it was so it wouldn't hurt itself. Mine spun then hooked and right after it hooked it tried to shift.

This is exactly what my truck has done several times also.

 

[onebadcoastie]

I buried the pedal from a stop and the truck went nowhere and the tach pegged out. I let off the throttle and once it settle the truck moved again. I was told that was the torque converter slipping. IDK though.

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

I have been told by a trans builder the trans will kick out of gear while spinning to protect itself. Is there any merit to this or is it in fact a shift flare?

I don't remember programming anything like that.

 

[BlueWaffle]

Have you ever hammered on it and let off right before a shift, and had the next gear slam in place?

yep...happens quite often for me. it'll hang between shifts for several seconds then it will finally slam into gear.

 

[BlueOvalDiesel]

I guess the big question is why exactly it does this and how bad is it for the transmission?

 

[peixinho]

Well not to start a battle but it looks like we are all just playing on words.

I know it does not adapt to "how someone drives" but it does adapt how fast it shifts depending on how much "torque" is applied.

Well those are pretty close to the same thing IMO... If I drive like a sissy for a couple thousand miles. Which I have done before. Like when I loaded a tune and went on a road trip without reloading the tune. I drove easy for days with people in the truck and driving in stop in go traffic. I was probably only pushing about 600tq at any given time. Well I got back to my normal daily driving and if I don't let the tranny relearn and I throw 1000tq at the truck for the first time with going through some sort of relearn process then the truck will "miss a shift" and go into neutral.


Sounds like we are all experiencing the same thing and we are playing on words to call it different things. I know the person who wrote the software is posting info and I agree with everything he says... but the computer does adapt to how much torque is being applied and that changes with driving habits and driving style.

 

[BlueOvalDiesel]

That's what I was trying to say ealier

 

[peixinho]

That's what I was trying to say ealier

Sorry... I was out for a few days and just getting caught up. I agree with you

 

[Mark Kovalsky]

Sounds like we are all experiencing the same thing and we are playing on words to call it different things. I know the person who wrote the software is posting info and I agree with everything he says... but the computer does adapt to how much torque is being applied and that changes with driving habits and driving style.

No, that's not how it works.

There is a large table of speed and load conditions for each shift. If you drive easy only the part of the table that is low speed and low load is adapted. Then if you drive hard the high speed high load part is adapted. Once the whole table is adapted there are only minimal changes from normal wear.

If you have adapted the whole table and then drive really easy for several days it will make minimal changes to the low speed light load portion of the table. The high speed high load portion is unaffected. If you then hammer it what has changed from driving easy WILL NOT AFFECT HOW THE HIGH SPEED HIGH LOAD PORTION WORKS.

Now having a tune can change EVERYTHING. I do not know what they did to modify my work, so maybe everything I'm saying is wrong about how your truck works with a tune.

 

[peixinho]

No, that's not how it works.

There is a large table of speed and load conditions for each shift. If you drive easy only the part of the table that is low speed and low load is adapted. Then if you drive hard the high speed high load part is adapted. Once the whole table is adapted there are only minimal changes from normal wear.

If you have adapted the whole table and then drive really easy for several days it will make minimal changes to the low speed light load portion of the table. The high speed high load portion is unaffected. If you then hammer it what has changed from driving easy WILL NOT AFFECT HOW THE HIGH SPEED HIGH LOAD PORTION WORKS.

Now having a tune can change EVERYTHING. I do not know what they did to modify my work, so maybe everything I'm saying is wrong about how your truck works with a tune.

^^^^ maybe this is where the confusion is...


Another note to add that might prove the above hypothesis correct. I have a couple of super hard shifting tunes ( i have like 30 tune/revisions from all different tuners). It usually takes a couple of weeks for them to soften up with normal easy daily driving. For the first few days - couple weeks of driving it felt like it would drop the transmission when it shifted and I was taking it easy. Shifted perfect at WOT... after a few weeks of driving easy then the tranny would calm down.