Who has had 180/30 or 180/80 for towing

[BS Hauler]

As the title says .
I have done all the mods and am down to getting injectors and tuning.
This is a tow rig and stays on the horse trailer all the time. We go from Iowa to Wyoming and it is interstate almost all the way. The speed limit is 80 in South Dakota and Wy so we are turning around 2,500 to 2,700 rpms. With this rpm's would the 80 over nozzles be better than the 30's. Will the pw get too long with the 30's
02 CCLB 4x6 6 spd 4:11 gears 235/85-16 tires. Bought new with 130,000 mi
6637
New Adrenalin pump
FRX
Boost fooler
New uppipes and heat wrapped
New 38R
8 ISSPRO gauges
MBRP full 4" exhaust
New fuel line system from fuel bowl to heads
We are about 24,000 # running down the road.

 

[Zeb]

Who will you use for tuning?

 

[DZL JIM]

180/30% for sure. They are awesome with the 38R.
You'll hate towing with a bigger nozzle.

 

[psduser1]

I disagree. I've had 180/100s for 5+ yrs, and I do a lot of towing.
Ran those injectors with a stock pump, an adrenaline, and a srp hpop. All did the job, although the bigger pump did it better, of course. All these were with the exact same chip/tuning.
38r, rr fuel, and other simple mods.
I usually tow on a "hot street" style tune, but with the stock pump, I just set it to the "race" tune, and rock it. No problems, until I'm towing 16k+, then the egts can climb.
I wouldn't be scared of the bigger nozzles at all.
In fact my next set of injectors will be 200%, but those I will have live tuned in the truck for two applications.

 

[Zeb]

I’ve had guys go with either size, and like them. I prefer to run a larger nozzle and shorter pulse width.
A 30% typically will be a little cleaner at low rpm, but I love how an 80% runs. If you’re worried about smoke with an 80%, just don’t lug it.
At the rpm you’ll be running, an Adrenaline, 185/80’s, good tuning, and 38R will be an animal.

 

[BS Hauler]

Thanks guys. With as much interstate running we do it just seems like the 30% overs were not going to gain us much for the amount of $ we were going to spend. It seemed like with the stock tuning and stock split shot injectors that when you get over 65 mph that the fuel mileage really crashes off because you just can't get the fuel into the cylinders fast enough. With the trailer at 55 mph I can get 14 mpg. At 65 to 70 mph I can get 11 mpg. But once I cross over about 75 it just crashes to about 7.5 mpg. I am not bitching about the mileage as much as it seems we are just overrunning the pw of the stock injectors and we are not using our fuel to it best. Is it possible to make a single shot injector say up to 200 or 205 cc instead of the 180's. Or would we run out of oil.

 

[Arisley]

Hybrids. I ran 250/250 hybrids. Adrenaline HPOP kept up just fine. A stock 17º pump probably would have kept up until you got to higher RPM's, however, my 15º would not.

 

[Zeb]

Thanks guys. With as much interstate running we do it just seems like the 30% overs were not going to gain us much for the amount of $ we were going to spend. It seemed like with the stock tuning and stock split shot injectors that when you get over 65 mph that the fuel mileage really crashes off because you just can't get the fuel into the cylinders fast enough. With the trailer at 55 mph I can get 14 mpg. At 65 to 70 mph I can get 11 mpg. But once I cross over about 75 it just crashes to about 7.5 mpg. I am not about the mileage as much as it seems we are just overrunning the pw of the stock injectors and we are not using our fuel to it best. Is it possible to make a single shot injector say up to 200 or 205 cc instead of the 180's. Or would we run out of oil.

I wouldn’t want to see a guy go larger than a 185cc A code and try to run it with an Adrenaline. You would not be able to maintain ICP. Hybrids are definitely your friend at that point.
238/80’s would be great if you go that direction.
We did 185/30’s, GTP38R, Adrenaline, Walbro GSL392 fuel pump, and RiffRaff FRx on a friends 2000 F250 cclb, 4x4. He loved it until he stepped up to 250/100 hybrids, and a KC38R. Now he really loves it!
He still tows regularly (not as heavy as you, but up to around 20,000 lbs gross) and his drag strip weight and mph puts him a little over 500hp to the ground.

 

[psduser1]

Hybrids. I ran 250/250 hybrids. Adrenaline HPOP kept up just fine. A stock 17º pump probably would have kept up until you got to higher RPM's, however, my 15º would not.

This^
Hybrids with an 80 or 100% nozzle would definitely relax the oil requirements.

 

[Dan V]

Thanks guys. With as much interstate running we do it just seems like the 30% overs were not going to gain us much for the amount of $ we were going to spend. It seemed like with the stock tuning and stock split shot injectors that when you get over 65 mph that the fuel mileage really crashes off because you just can't get the fuel into the cylinders fast enough. With the trailer at 55 mph I can get 14 mpg. At 65 to 70 mph I can get 11 mpg. But once I cross over about 75 it just crashes to about 7.5 mpg. I am not bitching about the mileage as much as it seems we are just overrunning the pw of the stock injectors and we are not using our fuel to it best. Is it possible to make a single shot injector say up to 200 or 205 cc instead of the 180's. Or would we run out of oil.

I tow a horse trailer similar to yours if not bigger. I run 160/30's, and I try not to tow above 65mph. I will run about 11mpg at that speed, if I go faster, it's just gets worse. IMO, it's not about overrunning the PW....it about pushing 22k GCVWR that has the aerodynamics of a shoebox to that speed.

I recently installed a Borg Warner 364.5SXE, which helped a fair bit in driveability.

 

[Petro]

180/30% for sure. They are awesome with the 38R.
You'll hate towing with a bigger nozzle.

I know we've gone over this several times before, but this is simply not true Unless your have completely sh!t tuning. Unless you hate cooler egts, then an 80 or 100% nozzle is far superior in every aspect. I prefer 200's, but that may be Overkill for many people.

 

[EPA]

So you're saying 180/80 are better for towing then the 30s how much of a cooler egt are we talking?

 

[PSD POWER007]

My 180/80’s with a BASB is a perfect tow set up. I could literally do away with my EGT probe if I wanted. Spools super fast and has plenty of power. And this is towing on my GH all out tune all of the time.

 

[TMCCOY]

I've been towing with new PIS 175/80's for 32K miles and they're awesome. I've towed coast to coast and spent most of the towing time in the west clearing the highest passes out there. The SXE turbo is a wonderful match for those injectors and is WAY better than the 38R I had which, coincidentally, ended up puking oil out the exhaust probably from the turbo surge I was experiencing with it on some harder pulls. Don't miss the screaming of that thing one bit either.

 

[cjfarm111]

Lots of guys think the 38r is the holy grail of turbos. And I agree with the sxe is a way better match then the 38r for those size injectors

 

[Peroni]

I've run both 175/30 and 175/100 and have to say that going to 200/30 hybrids has been a night and day improvement. All 3 have run on the same setup where only change was injectors and the tuning for them. Tried tuning from most of the major players and just couldn't get consistent results with a heavy (over 10K) load. So far the 200/30's are doing everything better and cooler than the A codes ever did. That's just my luck with them. I never saw the success that others have had with the larger nozzles.

 

[cjfarm111]

Great info! I would what would be so much different? I mean a lot of people claim that larger nozzles are better for towing because of the shorter pw needed?

 

[superpsd]

The downside with larger nozzles is the tuning is more critical to have right. Also A codes with large nozzles seem to have a bad reputation. You read too often on here about guys who switched to hybrids from stroked A codes that are happier with the hybrids. I love the 200% nozzles myself.

 

[cjfarm111]

Peroni can you tell any performance difference with 200 hybrids vs the 175 a codes? Cold starts, smoke and so on? Also who 175’s were you running g

 

[Peroni]

Peroni can you tell any performance difference with 200 hybrids vs the 175 a codes? Cold starts, smoke and so on? Also who 175’s were you running g

Besides being quieter there is no blue haze on startup with the hybrids. Power wise feels about the same. EGT's are considerably cooler across the board in all situations. If this were just a street truck then the 175/100 would have been fine. But for towing there is no comparison the hybrids have worked out great for me.



175/30's were from Swamps. After many many miles I sent them to PIS for a checkup and 100% nozzles since everyone had nothing but great things to say about them. In hindsight I should have left them alone, the 175/30's did work out fairly well for me for several years.



After my experience I agree with SUPERPSD in that tuning must be critical for larger nozzles, maybe if I got some live tuning things would have been different? But for apparently being so popular one would think tuners would have enough experience to get things pretty close after a few revisions and data logs? I ran GH, Swamps, 123Diesel, Power Struck, Dyno proven, Tyrant, PHP and TDP tuning with same issues despite datalogs and several tweaks. Got so frustrated I sent the 175/100's to a different vendor for a checkup and they came back with no real problems found.



I got sick of having such a hard time towing my trailer empty let alone loaded up to 11 tons. Chatted with Dave at Swamps, went with the recommended 200/30 hybrids and haven't looked back. Again just my personal experience. I have read of many guys who are happy towing heavy with a stroke A code w/ 100% or larger nozzles so YMMV.