Had a rebuilt Detroit 60 series in recently with free window porting and #5 rapid decompression kit only 1200 miles from a cumminGs type shop. Didn't put the wrist pins in correctly and the rods were machined instead of replaced just crap like that.
7.3 Engine Build Disaster
- Thread starter Black 02
- Start date
Had a rebuilt Detroit 60 series in recently with free window porting and #5 rapid decompression kit only 1200 miles from a cumminGs type shop. Didn't put the wrist pins in correctly and the rods were machined instead of replaced just crap like that.
OP just pull the block and have a tear down performed by another shop considering how most shops lack proper knowledge of performance heui oil systems and performance diesel engine blueprinting. Judging by the cam issue did you or have someone mic the cam for proper tolerances? Also it might not be a bad idea for the crank to be verified also.
silverpsd_06
New member
You must have the patience of a Saint.. I would be doing some very horrible things to the guy who built that engine. Hope it all gets worked out man, my buddy has a knack for coming by cheap 7.3 longblocks if that can help you in any way.
Spatel23
Moderator
backwoodsboy
New member
lulz.
Those filters can be tough when take into consideration 'proper knowledge of performance heui oil systems'.
zilla68
Active member
did you retain legal help?
if you got pictures of everything you say, you should be getting some cash back
if you got pictures of everything you say, you should be getting some cash back
Ask 5 shops get 40 answers, installation, rail plugs, hpop brand, injector size to turbo flow, tuners and lpo brand. The list goes on maybe 1 in a 100 shops are readily qualified in any performance diesel engine or transmission build(s) of this caliber. I have gotten the "I have done a few 6.0s" they call "head gaskets, machine the heads and studs" a engine build now that is the most common reply.
elrodalexander73
Member
After reading what you posted, this sounds like a true sloppy build, I have been building everything from 7.3s to 3412s and every thing in between. Any builder that is competent on a first time build should pay special attention to everything, I hand built my 7.3 myself and its a fairly stout engine, nothing to swamps level but it "runs good".. Take the engine apart all the way carefully, I have performed many warranty claims with Detroit diesel and Caterpillar and you always look for the root cause, and progressive damage, take pictures, document everything.. When you get the crank out look at the BEARINGS, if there is scoring outside the oil groove of the crank that could have caused a spun bearing it was built dirty.. Swamps is right about the connecting rods, but I had a guy on one install them wrong and the engine locked up on the stand.. So it can happen but I have never seen one run they have built a lot more than I have.. If the oil pump failed, remember there is metal every where, the entire block will have to be disassembled and cleaned accordingly. We rarely see full blown oil pump failures in the Class 7 and up engine industry, usually low oil pressure complaints first... Take your time on the tear down like I said and pay close attention to everything, these things happen all the time in the real world, if you saw how many DD15s I have pulled out with 20,000 mile crank failures.. It may even be an alignment issue in the mains. Good luck.
Sorry to hear about all your troubles. I have built a couple 7.3's and from experince every little detail needs to be met in these engines. Easy to make a mistake but if you have any knowledge of the 7.3 these issues your experiencing are avoided. Hope you get things ironed out and if you need anything feel free to pm
Garbage_Mechanic
Member
Very true and correct information. Doing diesel engine work for business is a whole nother game.
lincolnlocker
Well-known member
holy chit this sucks!! I sorta have some of the same issues you have with my built motor..
live life full throttle
live life full throttle
Black 02
New member
Hey guys!
Sorry for the delayed response. I was off the grid looking for bambi in eastern Oregon trying to forget about my truck issues.
The first link Joe posted is a diesel group. It's a closed group and I'm not a member either.
The second Facebook link is the correct one. I would kindly ask that people don't go on there and totally bash them just yet until I can find out if they monetarily make this correct. I have spoken with a lawyer and it does get tricky, but I should be entitled to some of my money back. If the rods were installed backwards, then I'd want every damn cent of my money back. I have not finalized that with the builder yet, so that it why I have not publically bashed them just yet. I'm only stating facts and there is nothing wrong with doing that.
Since I think there are two issues at hand, I was told by Full Force to send my 350/200's back and they'd check them out for me. Definitely something going on with one injector and they'd check them out to be sure. I will probably check the LPOP and see how it's looking. I installed it new.
I've been told to put the injectors in after I check the LPOP and run the engine for another 500 miles or so and see if it still makes metal in the oil. We shall see. I haven't decided it I want to do that or not. Some say the motor is already screwed. Others said it can't hurt to run it another 500 miles.
This is so flipping frustrating.
Sorry for the delayed response. I was off the grid looking for bambi in eastern Oregon trying to forget about my truck issues.
The first link Joe posted is a diesel group. It's a closed group and I'm not a member either.
The second Facebook link is the correct one. I would kindly ask that people don't go on there and totally bash them just yet until I can find out if they monetarily make this correct. I have spoken with a lawyer and it does get tricky, but I should be entitled to some of my money back. If the rods were installed backwards, then I'd want every damn cent of my money back. I have not finalized that with the builder yet, so that it why I have not publically bashed them just yet. I'm only stating facts and there is nothing wrong with doing that.
Since I think there are two issues at hand, I was told by Full Force to send my 350/200's back and they'd check them out for me. Definitely something going on with one injector and they'd check them out to be sure. I will probably check the LPOP and see how it's looking. I installed it new.
I've been told to put the injectors in after I check the LPOP and run the engine for another 500 miles or so and see if it still makes metal in the oil. We shall see. I haven't decided it I want to do that or not. Some say the motor is already screwed. Others said it can't hurt to run it another 500 miles.
This is so flipping frustrating.
Garbage_Mechanic
Member
I have built many an engine from Honda 70's to 3408 Cat and 8V92 Detriot.
On any one of them, for my self or a customer, if I found a dime size ball of metal in the oil pan it would be coming out and apart until I found the cause.
If nothing else, you now have many parts succeptable to damage from metal contaminated oil. LPOP, rod and mains, cam bearings, cam and roller surfaces, HPOP, injectors, turbo. I could not stand waiting to see what next. I would have to know. but that is also why I have built every engine myself over the years.
On any one of them, for my self or a customer, if I found a dime size ball of metal in the oil pan it would be coming out and apart until I found the cause.
If nothing else, you now have many parts succeptable to damage from metal contaminated oil. LPOP, rod and mains, cam bearings, cam and roller surfaces, HPOP, injectors, turbo. I could not stand waiting to see what next. I would have to know. but that is also why I have built every engine myself over the years.
Black 02
New member
Well, I want to thank everyone for all of their support and comments. This has been a trying situation and I'm just at a loss for words right now.
I wanted to thank Joe for passing this thread along in that post on the NWDC group on Facebook. I know he was just trying to inform people and the bros jumped all over him. I just became a member of the group and read the posts directed at me and at Joe.
All I'll say is that are a couple people that commented on my engine that have absolutely no idea what I've gone through or what evidence I have. The only two people that know the true story is me and the engine builder. One guy on there was trying to say that it was my fault that the engine blew up or is having all of these issues is because I installed the engine myself. What does installing an engine have to do with internal engine issues? It was also stated that I picked up a short block. We agreed to a completed engine. I picked up a half complete long block after finally saying I was done waiting after being drug out for over a year. It was also said that it was because of my money issues. I've paid cash for everything except my online part orders. I have the money. I wouldn't have started this build without expecting to spend some $$$.
Anyway, I decided not to respond on the Facebook group to the nonsense that was spewed by some that feel they know the situation. Joe (CSIPSD) has seen pictures of some of the stuff I've dealt with, so he does know. The others do not.
If anyone has any really specific questions, feel free to PM me.
Right now, I have to figure out what to do. There's definitely some steel flakes on the magnetic drain plug. I cut the filter open and found quite a bit of tiny bronze colored pieces in the filter and in the remaining oil in the filter. I'm guessing something is wrong with the motor internally.
This shouldn't have to be this hard.
I wanted to thank Joe for passing this thread along in that post on the NWDC group on Facebook. I know he was just trying to inform people and the bros jumped all over him. I just became a member of the group and read the posts directed at me and at Joe.
All I'll say is that are a couple people that commented on my engine that have absolutely no idea what I've gone through or what evidence I have. The only two people that know the true story is me and the engine builder. One guy on there was trying to say that it was my fault that the engine blew up or is having all of these issues is because I installed the engine myself. What does installing an engine have to do with internal engine issues? It was also stated that I picked up a short block. We agreed to a completed engine. I picked up a half complete long block after finally saying I was done waiting after being drug out for over a year. It was also said that it was because of my money issues. I've paid cash for everything except my online part orders. I have the money. I wouldn't have started this build without expecting to spend some $$$.
Anyway, I decided not to respond on the Facebook group to the nonsense that was spewed by some that feel they know the situation. Joe (CSIPSD) has seen pictures of some of the stuff I've dealt with, so he does know. The others do not.
If anyone has any really specific questions, feel free to PM me.
Right now, I have to figure out what to do. There's definitely some steel flakes on the magnetic drain plug. I cut the filter open and found quite a bit of tiny bronze colored pieces in the filter and in the remaining oil in the filter. I'm guessing something is wrong with the motor internally.
This shouldn't have to be this hard.
PSDEng
New member
Send in a UOA, the lab will be able to tell you what metals you have. Might give you some hard evidence if you end up needing it.
Derek@Vision Diesel
New member
Im sure it was already stated but wouldn't hurt to show it again..
How many miles on this fresh engine/how many oil changes since fresh/and what rebuild kit was used to put it all together?
gnxtc2
Active member
IdahoF350
New member
This is a bad deal, and an assembly mistake has probably cost this guy everything short of the block, heads, exterior covers and tin. The sad fact is, any part that had oil flowing through it MUST be removed, disassembled, inspected and rebuilt or replaced. Copper in the filter is the key to calling it a loss and pulling the engine.
I would suggest talking to a lawyer. Also, remove the engine as complete as possible and take it to a reputable builder for a documented tear down. You need photos from its complete state to a bare block, showing step by step detail of every part, failed of not. You also need a written affidavit from the person who disassembles the engine giving detailed information on the severity of the damage, and if possible, identification of the root cause. Document everything, and save this thread, along with any other discussions on the matter. Keep track of names and dates like it's your job. Proper documentation is the difference between a successful challenge in a courtroom and a failed one. More likely than not, the builder here does not have detailed build documents, in which case your autopsy, performed by a professional, will put you in a strong position to resolve this.
I would suggest talking to a lawyer. Also, remove the engine as complete as possible and take it to a reputable builder for a documented tear down. You need photos from its complete state to a bare block, showing step by step detail of every part, failed of not. You also need a written affidavit from the person who disassembles the engine giving detailed information on the severity of the damage, and if possible, identification of the root cause. Document everything, and save this thread, along with any other discussions on the matter. Keep track of names and dates like it's your job. Proper documentation is the difference between a successful challenge in a courtroom and a failed one. More likely than not, the builder here does not have detailed build documents, in which case your autopsy, performed by a professional, will put you in a strong position to resolve this.
V-Ref
Active member
I second the advice above.
I'd volunteer the use of an online photo/media hosting service I pay for (smugmug) that would enable you to create a digital library and folder that you can quickly link someone to in order to share or collaborate the findings.
emev0l
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Judges love documentation, when one guy shows up with a story and one shows up with documentation guess who wins.
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