Any good info on cams?

[Extended Power]

Sure can, out of how many of you that are asking about these cams how many of you really know how or what it means and what affects what???

So why should we post are hard work that other companies in the market haven't done just to give out specs on what has worked and what hasent. This is the exact reason why we test our products before they get released not just hit the market with something that is said to work. Like ported intake manifolds. Out of how many companies doing them have taken the time to actually figure out what is going on in the intake manifold that prevents the so called flow issues with the manifold,also how many have done before and after of this to prove gains were to be had???? Hell If I recall I have never seen a flow comparison of ported and not ported intake has anyone else ?? Either way this post is about cams not intake manifolds so I will get back to the subject.

It's like asking rcd who grinds their cams ? Does it matter ??? To me no. Because I don't care about the specs I care about what works. If I want to see specs or have a doubt I degree itand do the R&D spending my and my money on tgis matter This process cost my company a lot of money. To do all this work for just a cam change in a running truck not on a engine dyno here mind you so just for the job equates to over 35-40hrs of work to make happen. Not to mention material and paying our guys to do so. Sorry for anyone taking this in the wrong way. But this is a business and my time and money and effort is vested deeply in this project not just copying off colt or elite or rcd or whoever else wants to grind cams to say they have their own cam to sell. The market has gone away with trying their own products and own ideas because its not as profitable... I get it but I don't want my business ran this way. For anyone I have talked with on the phone about this matter or any others understands how I do business future past or present I want it right or to the best I can offer it that's it. And i have forgotten to mention that there will be no need for valve reliefs with this cam which should also save as a added cost to customer and do to the valve timing events should prove to be more efficient and making more power and better driveability Rant over ..

So tell me this...how do you degree a camshaft that does NOT provide the cam specs?:fustrate:

Say you did use a degree wheel...and found that you needed to advance/retard the cam 4 degrees...how do you do that?
Only company that has an adjustable cam gear is Elite.
And without knowing the specs of the cam, you have no option but installing it straight up....since you have no idea of the specs......once again.:doh:

 

[powerstroked08]

Well it wouldn't be a smart thing to be giving every spec out on a new cam that is apparently performing well. The reason why it wouldn't be a smart thing is when its how your making a living and you are doing all sorts of R&D on a cam (or any specialty part for that matter) and you give the info out for ANYBODY to copy. You just f*cked yourself. Now I don't have a dog in this fight( I have RCD, Elite, Midwest, side action, and many other vendors parts on my truck) But for what reason do ALL of the particulars of this cam have to be out i the open? Does everybody here know the impact or the effects of lobe separation, lift, duration and valve timing? I mean really understand how all of this works. Honestly very few people do, and I'm not saying I'm one of them! But I do have the respect for those that do and like to learn from them. But the point is that there are several ways to make power, and this cam seems to be doing that(at least according to the power increase that was posted) Honestly that's all the info that most of us need at this point. Unless you want to get all nerdy and figure out every aspect of its design(which is cool to know and understand). But think about it does roush/yates divulge all of their info on their latest and greatest engines and what not? NO! They don't and there's a good reason for that. They want to stay AHEAD of the competition, not do all sorts of R&D and publish all of their findings for every other race shop to copy and or apply to their setup. Again this isn't my problem, but we need to understand why he doesn't want to show the entire world what he has been working on.
:toast:

 

[Extended Power]

And for 99% of the buyers, that's what they need to know to buy a cam...it makes more power than a stock cam.
Pretty sure you can google any camshaft for a small block Chevy, Ford, dodge, whatever...and you will be able to see the cam specs.

In fact...look at all the cam specs that I posted from Elite, RCD, and Colt...are any of them the same? NOPE!
Did they all post there specs on the Internet for all to see? YEP!

To ask a third more money for a cam with no specs, no video, no graph, and one dyno, is kinda foolish....anyone remember the first edition Steed manifolds for the 6.0L?
Everyone who had them praised them....until one person questioned them, and actually tested them, and lost power.

Why should people buy into a cam that wasn't even run on a 6.0L? (This is the 6.0L section right?)
If I brought a cam that didn't say something like: it is recommended that you need this much compression, this much spring pressure, this much stall, this much gearing, this much rpm, and this much for valve reliefs...I'm in doubt of its performance.

This is the Aftermarket Performance section, not the stock, daily driver section.
If it "drops in"...it's not enough gain for my application...unless someone else wants to build my setup, and try it.

Rant Overint:

 

[powerstroked08]

Your stall is dependent on your turbos not your cam really. If you have a giant single your going to need more air flow out the exhaust to drive the turbo enough to spool up. So you increase your stall to get more rpms. Not for your cam. This isn't the gas world but either way i understand your bitch about the steed speeds. I get it. But if you have lets say some "mystery cam" that you don't know every single tid bit of info on and you don't need to fly cut your pistons for or whatever. And there is another cam that you need to fly cut for and you don't gain any more power over the one that doesn't require fly cutting..... And so far with the info we have at this point there is another cam in the works that is for trucks that are as built as yours and beyond. So maybe hang on until that comes out? Just saying.

 

[sootie]

Of course stall matters. The cam plays a big part in spooling chargers. If it drives them hard at low rpm you can run a lower stall

 

[powerstroked08]

Yes I get that. But no cam out for us (6.0/6.4) guys has any info regarding stall. I guess I was being ever simplified for this thread.

 

[strokin6L]

Sure can, out of how many of you that are asking about these cams how many of you really know how or what it means and what affects what???

So why should we post are hard work that other companies in the market haven't done just to give out specs on what has worked and what hasent. This is the exact reason why we test our products before they get released not just hit the market with something that is said to work. Like ported intake manifolds. Out of how many companies doing them have taken the time to actually figure out what is going on in the intake manifold that prevents the so called flow issues with the manifold,also how many have done before and after of this to prove gains were to be had???? Hell If I recall I have never seen a flow comparison of ported and not ported intake has anyone else ?? Either way this post is about cams not intake manifolds so I will get back to the subject.

It's like asking rcd who grinds their cams ? Does it matter ??? To me no. Because I don't care about the specs I care about what works. If I want to see specs or have a doubt I degree it and do the R&D spending my and my money on tgis matter This process cost my company a lot of money. To do all this work for just a cam change in a running truck not on a engine dyno here mind you so just for the job equates to over 35-40hrs of work to make happen. Not to mention material and paying our guys to do so. Sorry for anyone taking this in the wrong way. But this is a business and my time and money and effort is vested deeply in this project not just copying off colt or elite or rcd or whoever else wants to grind cams to say they have their own cam to sell. The market has gone away with trying their own products and own ideas because its not as profitable... I get it but I don't want my business ran this way. For anyone I have talked with on the phone about this matter or any others understands how I do business future past or present I want it right or to the best I can offer it that's it. And i have forgotten to mention that there will be no need for valve reliefs with this cam which should also save as a added cost to customer and do to the valve timing events should prove to be more efficient and making more power and better driveability Rant over ..[

Just to answer the flow on stock and ported manifolds....yes there is before and after flow numbers on a ported intake manifold! It was done with Oliver's ported manifold!

 

[sideactiondiesel]

If it "drops in"...it's not enough gain for my application...unless someone else wants to build my setup, and try it.Rant Over

And you don't see how they are only a few degrees off ?? Hmm wonder because who can prove they copied who if you release specs right ?? Because hell one or 2 degrees isn't going to break the bank here.

We are talking about a completely different design like nothing on the market and I'm not willing to give up my proprietary information or chris's just so someone can act like they know what they are doing. We have both worked hard on this. If you want to change centerline of my lobe sep go ahead. But I'm making that call for my customers not anyone else. And 99% of my customers would never question it because they know how I am strait forward and to the point no BS . I'm not a salseman I'm a business owner I want to stay in business not just push parts to make a living.




What if I was to tell you that this cam will do more then any others and if it doesn't I will buy u a brand new what ever brand you want cam u going to doubt me then?

The market gambles on hoping things work ... I provide proof it works. As to how much?? Well we won't know until I get new turbos on the truck because we have pushed the larger sized turbin in the High pressure unit past its flow point already with this cam and IAT temps have risen significantly yet we made more power due to the drive pressure and efficiancy of the cam.

 

[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

Ok, for the people who have questions on the billet RCD cams, none of you will have any idea who grinds their cams. So no point in saying a name. It's not a "cam" company. They go to the source and buy the billets, have them ground to their specs... No "cam" builder or cam company.

The specs are on their website and ours.

We have used there cams in literally 20+ engines so far with great results. Not to mention how many we have sold to customers.

As far as hp, like in the gas world, we bought and spec'd cams to our liking and needs. RCD lists all you need to install them. They all have corrected timing to install without major changes...

As far as hp, we had a dual pump 59/75 truck do 780 on the dyno and backed up by track times. So, take it fwiw.. If anyone needs any info or cams we have all of them in stock.

If anyone has a question give us a shout at 217-718-6119


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[sideactiondiesel]

Yep I'm done.:fustrate:

 

[strokin6L]

The colt stage 2 and the RCD stage 2 both do not require valve reliefs just like this cam. So this isn't the only cam that wouldnt require them!

 

[strokin6L]

I can see where both you and Ivan are coming from Brenton. For myself....I know from hearing from others running a colt stage 2 cam with a fairly mild setup...that it made a big difference. I would have a hard time deciding on whether or not Chris' cam is worth the extra $300 over a colt stage 2.

 

[sideactiondiesel]

Not do discredit Geoff at all great guy and does quality work. And this was before everyone wanted to be a cam manufacture. But our cam drives harder then the colt. And that's real world feel from trucks we have not only dyno #s but real world driving . if it wasn't winter we would've been at the track that day we did the cam swap. But since it's snow here and 20* out I feel I won't do that well at the track lol

 

[strokin6L]

Not do discredit Geoff at all great guy and does quality work. And this was before everyone wanted to be a cam manufacture. But our cam drives harder then the colt. And that's real world feel from trucks we have not only dyno #s but real world driving . if it wasn't winter we would've been at the track that day we did the cam swap. But since it's snow here and 20* out I feel I won't do that well at the track lol

Thanks for your feedback Brenton! I've got a few months to decide!

 

[Extended Power]

Not do discredit Geoff at all great guy and does quality work. And this was before everyone wanted to be a cam manufacture. But our cam drives harder then the colt. And that's real world feel from trucks we have not only dyno #s but real world driving . if it wasn't winter we would've been at the track that day we did the cam swap. But since it's snow here and 20* out I feel I won't do that well at the track lol

I'm sorry to keep Pickin on you but really?
Now it's "Your" cam?:lame:
I'm just going to put down a few things that bug me about your "Feedback".

-It wasn't done on a 6.0L engine, but you keep updating it, as if it were.

-You didn't start with a base run, if you did, post the results, including the temperature, and altitude.

-still haven't posted the dyno run video, or graph.

-didn't answer my question as to how you degree a cam without knowing the specs of it.

-didn't answer my question of how you degree a cam even if you did know the cam specs, since there is only one company who makes an adjustable cam gear. (Elite Diesel Performance, as far as I know)

-your dyno run was done at 20*F ambient? Doors open to that, or did they have the exhaust plumbed outside, and used room temperature? And to be driving in 20*F...isn't it weird how an engine makes more power with cold air...

-you said your turbos were out of their map....did you forget about the rail pressure already?

-and last but not least...running down a competitors cam, "Colt Cams"....since it's not yours...is not a nice thing to do...post a graph of your engine running a Colt Cam, and compare it to "Your" cam, as we all know the buttometer lies like a sidewalk.

There....now I'm done with this thread...too bad there's no useful information in it, except for the cam specs I posted of all the other companies cam profiles.

 

[sideactiondiesel]

Extended power. Your right I feel like this cam just isn't for you especially since its just a drop in thank you for all the great questions hope it helps out other members on here you really sound like u have it all figured out .

 

[Groomzybanshee]

Ok, for the people who have questions on the billet RCD cams, none of you will have any idea who grinds their cams. So no point in saying a name. It's not a "cam" company. They go to the source and buy the billets, have them ground to their specs... No "cam" builder or cam company.

The specs are on their website and ours.

We have used there cams in literally 20+ engines so far with great results. Not to mention how many we have sold to customers.

As far as hp, like in the gas world, we bought and spec'd cams to our liking and needs. RCD lists all you need to install them. They all have corrected timing to install without major changes...

As far as hp, we had a dual pump 59/75 truck do 780 on the dyno and backed up by track times. So, take it fwiw.. If anyone needs any info or cams we have all of them in stock.

If anyone has a question give us a shout at 217-718-6119


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On stock fuel??

 

[KCTurbos]

WOW! This thread did not go the way I was hoping. I am hoping we can get back on track a little bit and don't want to start anything. BUT i wanted to point out a few things.

I notice a lot of negativity towards straub cams and side action diesel... I agree with many of the points you are making and I appreciate your input/data, but I wanted to run a few things by you. KEEP IN MIND I AM NOT SELLING ANYTHING, just doing research.

If you really are interested in the specs for the straub cams then give him a call. I am not sure if they have decided anything 100% but he was MORE THAN WILLING to share any and all info. Most of the questions that you are asking were answered when I talked to him over the phone but I did not write anything down.

Also... You seem to be stuck a lot of how straub has not provided any data/results... in all my searching they are the FIRST to provide ANY sort of before/after information. All the rest simply added a cam during a big build and said how much they like the cam.



Side action diesel does not have the "rights" to straub cams... BUT... Chris/straub said that he would be willing to make custom grinds for anyone... so it is quite possible for side action diesel to make their own exclusive cam and sell it as their own. I am not saying thats what they are doing but it was asked why they keep calling them "their cams"... so maybe they have an exclusive design

On that same note the first cam straub is planning to release are for "stockish" trucks looking to keep the same power band. He told me that he would custom grind a cam for ANY application so if you want to move the power band up in the rpms then that is definitely possible.


6.0 and 6.4 trucks are very different, but they share the same cam, similar displacement, similar heads, similar intake, etc... I take it with a grain of salt but I appreciate the info that side action has presented.



Anybody else have any actual info on cams? Maybe at what point one should jump from a stage 2 to stage 3? If there is any loss in bottom end?
:ford:

 

[TyCorr]

Im an observer. I dont currently own a 6l but am driving sojeone elses built truck. An 04 cclb xl with 190/100s and a 68mm turbo. Its got rcd tuning. I enjoy the power.

Ill just say Ivan may be coming off as harsh but as someone who built a very powerful setup and revealed some inadequacies in the information chain for 6l aftermarket.

I take his stance as pretty simple. Put it up, or shut up. Information is useful for progress but secret squirrel crap needs to be abolished.

People can disseminate secrets anyway. It takes very little for someone who knows measure a "secret cam".

Back to my fly costume. On the wall.

 

[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

On stock fuel??

Hell no lol. Dual pumps and 30%


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