HEY: All you PMF RSK guys look here!!!!

[rusty1161]

Ummm, if I read your earlier post you said that pmf's 2.5" is the same as your 3". Well I didn't and never have wanted a 2.5". I WANTED a 2.25". Do the math. That's 1/4".

Yours still requires welding, no? Wanted 100% bolt on so that's another season on top of the added height to not use a Sky kit.

And answer me this, why do most that have a 3" sky rsk like you push, need a 5" rear block to make it level? But people that run a 2.25" PMF rsk are level with a 4" rear block?

5" below yours is an overstatement. It'd actually be 4.5". You see, I'm running 2" blocks in the rear and 4800lb coils in the front. The front sits 1.5" lower than the rear because to me, that's a true leveled look with the way the body lines look. I'd assume that your "stock" coil spring conversion uses 4" rear blocks and is either level with the 2.5" 4-link kit, or requires a 5" block in back for level. Well based on the latter, I'm a true 3" lower in the rear and 4.5" in the front.

The only issue I have is when people ask legitimate questions, your "go to" response is - We designed this mod 15 years ago and have everything you need. Pm me. We specialize in..... And you stick your jabs in when you can to voice your disapproval of ones choices when doing it themselves - "oh never trust a bolt on only, we weld all of ours", "you cannot use stock SD parts, you will have issues. Buy our weld on... ". Obviously I'm paraphrasing but those are prime examples.

Another example is this thread I started last summer... In the title it says specifically "PMF RSK users". Your response in a thread specific to a PMF product and clearance for an aftermarket i/c is "we've ran one for 15 years with our kit no problem.". Well hell I'm not asking about how it fits with your product so how is input about fitment in relation to YOUR product going to help????? That's right, it won't.

Well said. Cary's responses as of late have made me regret past purchases and reconsider future ones. There are ways to share your opinion with class and respect for your current and future customers. Your reputation led me to believe your recommendations as gospel and it was a fairly expensive lesson for me. Life goes on.

Rusty

 

[Strokersace]

Stroker, do you have enough info to do a writeup on the 06 install?

Yes Dave, I just need to take the time at the computer to out it all together. Frank the Tank was a huge help with measurement for the buckets and such. I have a ton of pictures and need to get them together.

 

[zilla68]

I bought pmf also, should be here Monday, and can't wait to get it on.

 

[Tom S]

I bought pmf also, should be here Monday, and can't wait to get it on.

Let us know what you think.

 

[Swaan]

Back to the cross bar. Honestly. It's over kill. Just don't use it. I know you guys are gonna be like what your crazy. But I whacked mine off 3 years ago when I installed my sky kit. It was in the way of my 6.0 ic. After looking at how overkill all the brackets are and taking into account the factory suspension has no bar, I cut it off with the chopsaw and never looked back. Truck drives fine. Don't forget. These trucks have a track bar, so that axel is never going anywhere. The spring hangers on the sky kit are 4 times thicker then the factory stuff. And the frame horns on the front are equally beefy. So never did understand the need for the cross bar. Sure it will make it stronger, but is it really needed , no. It's plenty strong without it.Sometimes I think people over engineer things just cuz they can. Lol

 

[DieselFreak92]

From the looks of it you wont be able to clear your intercooler with a pre-welded PMF kit... Best bet is to weld in the crossbar yourself or not run one. This is my old truck... Cannot express my love for this kit enough. Even had to call Trevor with questions and got them answered right away. Cant wait to do it on my single cab.

 

[NotStock]

On many of the intercooler installs I have seen, the bottom of the IC is pretty much flush with the bottom of the frame. With this type of install, the crossbar will clear, even if it hangs down a little. The top of the crossbar is an 1 5/8" from the bottom of the frame to the top of the crossmember. We have spaced the crossmember down as far as we can to not interfere with the spring wrap.
I would be a little concerned with not running a crossbar of some sort. The next nearest crossmember is under the oil pan. Thats a lot of frame sticking out that the springs could potentially twist. The higher the lift, the more leverage is being applied to the frame rails as well. Im not disputing that it hasnt worked for you, I just dont feel comfortable saying that it would be ok for everyone.

 

[NotStock]

Additionally, if there is a better placement of the crossbar that will be more convenient for IC install and such. Im happy to do my best to move it to that location. Given the requirements I had at hand when I designed it, this was the best I could find. As always, I want to build the best possible kit. Sometimes that means making changes as they are discovered.

 

[Swaan]

On many of the intercooler installs I have seen, the bottom of the IC is pretty much flush with the bottom of the frame. With this type of install, the crossbar will clear, even if it hangs down a little. The top of the crossbar is an 1 5/8" from the bottom of the frame to the top of the crossmember. We have spaced the crossmember down as far as we can to not interfere with the spring wrap.
I would be a little concerned with not running a crossbar of some sort. The next nearest crossmember is under the oil pan. Thats a lot of frame sticking out that the springs could potentially twist. The higher the lift, the more leverage is being applied to the frame rails as well. Im not disputing that it hasnt worked for you, I just dont feel comfortable saying that it would be ok for everyone.

Those super duty springs are like wet noddles compared to the stock springs. They will twist like crazy before making the frame twist. Let's not forget about the big ass bumper hanging off the front of the frame. It's bolted on really well also, and in a way is acting just like another cross member. There's nothing wrong with running a cross bar but really it's soooooo overkill. I can see running a crossbar in a serious off road machine like in the Baja 1000 or something. But who ever does that. :doh:

 

[backwoodsboy]

Those super duty springs are like wet noddles compared to the stock springs. They will twist like crazy before making the frame twist. Let's not forget about the big ass bumper hanging off the front of the frame. It's bolted on really well also, and in a way is acting just like another cross member. There's nothing wrong with running a cross bar but really it's soooooo overkill. I can see running a crossbar in a serious off road machine like in the Baja 1000 or something. But who ever does that. :doh:

Are you an engineer?

 

[Swaan]

Are you an engineer?

Nope, not a engineer.
But I have my own shop and do a lot of fabricating and building for over 20 years. In my opinion that bar just is not needed in 99% of all cases. I can see why the manufactures would build it with one thou. Nothing wrong with it and I would be running one too if my ic didn't have clearance issues with it. All I'm saying is, if it's a issue , buck it off. You won't miss it.
A guy would have to be doing some serious rock crawling or bending your truck up like a pretzel before you'd encounter issues with frame flex. These guys build some great kits!! All there hangers are built very strong. At least my sky kit is like this.
All you gotta look at is the stock hangers and shackles. Then look at what sky gives you. There's no comparison, none!!!!
Guys lift these trucks all the time with the stock hardware that came from ford. You don't see these people installing cross bars. Some of these people are running around with 6-8-10 inch lifts , with spring packs with hardly any give.
Just a thought!!

 

[Strokersace]

Nope, not a engineer.
But I have my own shop and do a lot of fabricating and building for over 20 years. In my opinion that bar just is not needed in 99% of all cases. I can see why the manufactures would build it with one thou. Nothing wrong with it and I would be running one too if my ic didn't have clearance issues with it. All I'm saying is, if it's a issue , buck it off. You won't miss it.
A guy would have to be doing some serious rock crawling or bending your truck up like a pretzel before you'd encounter issues with frame flex. These guys build some great kits!! All there hangers are built very strong. At least my sky kit is like this.
All you gotta look at is the stock hangers and shackles. Then look at what sky gives you. There's no comparison, none!!!!
Guys lift these trucks all the time with the stock hardware that came from ford. You don't see these people installing cross bars. Some of these people are running around with 6-8-10 inch lifts , with spring packs with hardly any give.
Just a thought!!

So explain this... Why did Ford start putting a factory "crossmember" (for lack of a better term) between the front spring mounts on the 2000+ SD's?

 

[taterthedog]

So explain this... Why did Ford start putting a factory "crossmember" (for lack of a better term) between the front spring mounts on the 2000+ SD's?

I believe that is just an impact bar for collisions with smaller vehicles. I think it's purpose is so you don't run up on smaller vehicles.


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[jschildm]

I believe adding rigidity to the outer portion of the frame since they added factory tow hooks also might have played a role.

 

[glovemeister]

I believe that is just an impact bar for collisions with smaller vehicles. I think it's purpose is so you don't run up on smaller vehicles.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep.

http://www.leftlanenews.com/research-confirms-blockerbeam-saves-lives.html

"Starting in October 2000, all 2001 model year F250, F350, F450, and F550 trucks will have front Blocker Beams as
standard equipment. This unique beam is included to enhance under ride crash protection and was first introduced on the
2000 Excursion. During a frontal collision with a car, the Blocker Beam is designed to prevent the car from sliding beneath
the higher riding front truck bumper.

Removal of the Blocker Beam, without the installation of snowplow attachment hardware, may affect air bag deployment
in a crash. The truck should not be operated without either the snowplow mounting hardware or the Blocker Beam in
place, It is possible that some snowplow mounts may be installable without removing the Blocker Beam. This
configuration is also acceptable."

 

[Tom S]

I would one take a look at the puny bolts that attach the bumper to the bumper brackets. I think there would be some difference in not running cross bar on a low lift kit vs a tall one.

 

[Krause]

I like the fact that the front gets an additional support with the crossbar, but I think part of the point Swaan is trying to make is that all the non-rsk truck's have no cross-bar and they all do just fine. Perhaps there is some difference in the forces when the shackle is reversed, but at the end of the day it's still the same amount of weight over the front axle, and the truck handles it just fine stock, should do just fine with the shackle reversed. Again, I'm an overkill type so I like it but to each their own.

 

[old man dave]

I would one take a look at the puny bolts that attach the bumper to the bumper brackets. I think there would be some difference in not running cross bar on a low lift kit vs a tall one.

SuperDuty bumpers are mounted with a few mighty small bolts. Almost looks like the bumper is just on for decoration. Changed out the front springs on an SD and we removed the bumper. Small bolts and the bumper was lightweight also. I was kinda surprised...

 

[backwoodsboy]

Nope, not a engineer.
But I have my own shop and do a lot of fabricating and building for over 20 years. In my opinion that bar just is not needed in 99% of all cases. I can see why the manufactures would build it with one thou. Nothing wrong with it and I would be running one too if my ic didn't have clearance issues with it. All I'm saying is, if it's a issue , buck it off. You won't miss it.
A guy would have to be doing some serious rock crawling or bending your truck up like a pretzel before you'd encounter issues with frame flex. These guys build some great kits!! All there hangers are built very strong. At least my sky kit is like this.
All you gotta look at is the stock hangers and shackles. Then look at what sky gives you. There's no comparison, none!!!!
Guys lift these trucks all the time with the stock hardware that came from ford. You don't see these people installing cross bars. Some of these people are running around with 6-8-10 inch lifts , with spring packs with hardly any give.
Just a thought!!

If you think about the function of a shackle, you will see how relocating it to the rear greatly increases the forces present at the front spring hanger.

 

[old man dave]

If you think about the function of a shackle, you will see how relocating it to the rear greatly increases the forces present at the front spring hanger.

So, what does moving the shackle to the rear have to do with stresses on the front spring mount and crossbar?