My tow pig/DD build thread. F350/Cummins 6.7/twins/6R140
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Strokersace
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Or maybe he wants to have a nice looking pickup with his ford that doesn't look like a whale's abortion (ram truck). Good looking rig, that the body will hold up on, that has the power, towing, and reliability of the cummins powerplant. No brainer!!
If he just bought a dodge like most that can't see outside if their own tunnel vision say he should, then he'd never get to pull his 5th wheel, which is the purpose of the build anyway, because the whale's abortion of a dodge would be in the shop getting its body fixed or suspension fixed or something fixed. Just cause the dodge comes with a cummins doesn't mean the motor keeps everything else together.
Personally, I love the "outside the box" thinking to this build! And he's got plenty of justification and personal reasons for doing it. Maybe doing it different than some, but its all his when complete. Not another one like it. Regardless if you agree with what he's doing or not, and specific mods, I support it 1000% cause its his and unique.
I know I've had plenty that came to me about my mods and said, "why'd you do that? It would have been way easier if you just did this...". My response - BECAUSE I COULD!
If he just bought a dodge like most that can't see outside if their own tunnel vision say he should, then he'd never get to pull his 5th wheel, which is the purpose of the build anyway, because the whale's abortion of a dodge would be in the shop getting its body fixed or suspension fixed or something fixed. Just cause the dodge comes with a cummins doesn't mean the motor keeps everything else together.
Personally, I love the "outside the box" thinking to this build! And he's got plenty of justification and personal reasons for doing it. Maybe doing it different than some, but its all his when complete. Not another one like it. Regardless if you agree with what he's doing or not, and specific mods, I support it 1000% cause its his and unique.
I know I've had plenty that came to me about my mods and said, "why'd you do that? It would have been way easier if you just did this...". My response - BECAUSE I COULD!
It absolutely is not. And my wife doesn't care for the Dodge crew cab.
As a dually. I don't want a dually if I can avoid it. My 08 (SRW, GVWR 11,500) handles our trailer well. Its lighter than a Dodge dually, so probably has about the same payload.
With a 4.10 axle and 17" tires. Put on a larger tire and the axle ratio is back to the equivalent of 3.73 and the rating drops to 21K again.
Behind a stock engine, the weakest of the big 3. Transmission builders will not guarantee a 68RFE behind a built engine for towing use. Work is underway by the aftermarket guys to build a stronger replacement OD drum, which is the major limitation in the transmission.
Agreed.
Don't need them, don't want them. And what would a 19.5 conversion cost ? Lots.
They are smaller. I really like how the SD mirrors are power telescopic and power folding, especially for daily driving use.
When all is said and done, this project isn't going to cost a whole lot. I'll get as much for the 6.4 as what I paid for the 6.7. After that, its just the cost of the mods, most of which I would do on either truck anyway. So the cost is a moot point.
Actually, I picked up the 6R140 for $2400 with TC and its cost is offset by selling my 5R110. A 68RFE would need to be built by a transmission builder and there is no way you could do that and buy a 68RFE TC for ~$1500.
And besides, I like Ford trucks.
That is all I am going to say on this subject.
I can't wait to restart working on this project.
Thanks for the support, SA.
Personally I would never tow a big 5er with a SRW truck. Yes it can be done But that does not mean It SHOULD be done. As for the 19.5s, the dealer installed the 225/70/19.5 tires on aluminum wheels for 1200.00 a d he kept the 17s that came on the Truck. They are 32" tall which is exactly the same at the 17s it came with the speedo did not even have to be recalled. I bought my truck in Sep of 2010 and have 170,000 miles on it. I hotshot trailers out of Elkhart In so at least 120,000 of those miles have been hauling. It has been back to the dealer twice. @ 110,000 miles it needed ballpoints and shocks, and last month I had to get a red lash so my new IPhone would work with the Bluetooth that is all. Good luck with your build. I would leave the 6.7 stock, you will love it compared to the 6.4 or 6.0.
You must not have sat in a crew cab Ram of you think it's smaller than the SD. Are you sure you are not thinking of the club cab? They are both 4 drs.
You must not have sat in a crew cab Ram of you think it's smaller than the SD. Are you sure you are not thinking of the club cab? They are both 4 drs.
bad12jr
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Not my build but because I'm tired of reading " why not just buy a dodge?" Its his truck and he wants what he wants in his truck. He's building a ford not buying a dodge so quit with the stupid comments.
On subject with the build. What did the bilsteins set you back. Did they seem to help the ride of the truck?
Sent from my x2 somewhere
On subject with the build. What did the bilsteins set you back. Did they seem to help the ride of the truck?
Sent from my x2 somewhere
Strokersace
Well-known member
Why criticize his motives, reasons, etc? You've already proved its not the way you'd do it. But it ain't your rig. If you don't like the way he's going at it then don't look at the thread. Pretty simple really!
And if you read the posts in the thread, you'd know where he's at and he's already addressed the emissions.
Enough mucking up this awesome build thread. Me2, good on ya and build a badazz monster!!
Hotrodtractor
Moderator
OK guys - the OP has clearly stated why on numerous occasions - I even question some parts choices myself - BUT if you think that just buying a new Dodge Cummins is the answer to everything then perhaps you might be on the wrong website - this site was founded on improvements and modifications to these trucks - some of the minor - some of them major like this build. Those that want to can build things that are far superior as a whole than anything that can be purchased from the OEM manufacturer.
Lets stop asking the OP why when he has clearly stated and just support the build with insightful questions and help with tech.
Lets stop asking the OP why when he has clearly stated and just support the build with insightful questions and help with tech.
Johnny77Mutt
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This truck is going to be truley unique, good luck with everything.
03excursion
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nice awesome build wanting to this to my excursion but everyone is saying get the zf6 instead of auto i would love to use the same combo motor and trans you are but have you figured out how to get the trans to work. or any update on this its a awesome build keep it up
Trip Blatherings
I'm back.
We've been on holidays with our truck and trailer since August 2nd.
We had an awesome, awesome time. So much to see and do ! We love the water and we swam or were on our kayaks every day except 2 travel days. Everyone has a great tan and a big smile. We were all exhausted when we got home.
Swap wise, it was very motivating to see how much fun we had and how much everyone enjoyed themselves. This is why we have a truck and a trailer and improving the truck with a swap will only make our trips better. We are hoping to do another long trip in March. I can't wait.
We traveled about 2700 miles in all on this trip, with lots of mountain driving. I lost track of how many mountain passes we went over.
This was the first time I towed with my truck in the mountains. Overall, it worked well. I'm glad that I got to use it stock before I did the swap, but it sure would have been nice to have had the swap done for this trip.
My truck is still a terrible fuel pig. I didn't calculate any numbers, but 8 MPG is the norm in good conditions, less than that in the mountains. I am not driving it hard at all. I almost never cruise with the trailer at much over 60 MPH. And I was feathering the throttle when climbing. Its incredible how much fuel this thing uses. I wouldn't believe it myself if I wasn't seeing it first hand.
Power is OK, but there were a lot of mountain climbs where I was down to 40 MPH and there were several times that I was down to 25-30 MPH when climbing.
I didn't let the engine wind out at 3,000 RPM when climbing. When it downshifted to full engine RPM, I took it off of cruise control and feathered the throttle to run the engine about 2600 RPM. More engine speed than that just created more fan noise and probably used more fuel.
I was surprised how often the fan was running. Even when we were travelling at night with temps in the 70s the fan was almost always on when climbing. With my '99 (5.9 CR and no fan shroud) the fan almost never comes one. I think I've only heard it come on half a dozen times ever. It will be interesting to see how much the fan runs with the 6.7.
Handling wise, my truck tows our trailer like a dream. Twisty mountain passes are no problem and the truck always feels in control. The ride is much improved with the Bilstein 5160s, to the point that its almost plush with the trailer behind. Its still rough when empty, but the 5160s helped a lot.
The limit slip in the rear diff still makes some noise and chatters once in a while, but its much better than it used to be. Its like my '99 now.
Axle wrap is a problem with these trucks. They have longer rear leaf springs than the pre 08s. In one campground I had to start out on a steep gravel hill with the trailer behind. It took three attemps to get going without tearing the drivetrain out due to axle hop.
The 5R110 is a mixed blessing. I think the transmission itself is great. I can see why people like it. It always seems to shift well, no matter what the conditions.
I think the torque converter is way too mushy and isn't locked nearly enough, especially in lower gears in Tow-Haul mode.
I love the engine braking in Tow-Haul mode, but its big pain in the butt and a serious misuse of brakes that the only way to "manually" engage engine braking is to stab the brakes hard.
The 5R110 would be a totally different transmission if it was manually controlled like the 6R140 can be.
I still think that 3rd gear should have been faster. It sucks to have to keep the speed down to 60 MPH or so when engine braking in 3rd gear to keep the engine RPMs below 3,000.
Overall, I used the truck/trailer brakes way more with the 5R110 than I would have with a ZF6. I am really looking forward to having manual control of the 6R140.
The kids LOVED the DVD player.
The Ford 08 Nav system totally sucks. In the course of our travels, navigation issues probably cost us 8 hours of travel time in total. It will be replaced before out next long trip.
I've upgraded the nav system in my truck with pretty much the latest maps. The maps are fine, content wise. They are pretty much always right for an area. However, on an 08 there is no practical way to zoom in and out significantly and there is no way to scroll to see more of the area around where you currently are, other than what is on the screen.
The big problem with the 08 nav system is routing. The routing is TERRIBLE. The routes it selects are not wrong. They will get you there. Its just that it always seems to select a very slow, congested way to get to the destination. I've tried changing several of the routing options in setup, but the behavior is always the same. I suspect its going for the shortest route at all costs rather than the fastest route.
Instead of taking a freeway to get within a mile of the destination, the GPS will instruct you to turn off 10 miles before the destination and take side streets the rest of the way. Sometimes its obvious that the route is wrong, but sometimes it isn't. Its the later that causes the problem.
We came to rely on using a map in conjunction with the GPS to get where we were going. Generally we used the map to make the big route decisions on how to get 90% of the way there and then used the GPS to guide us the rest of the way. Getting on the right freeway and taking the right freeway exit solved 90% of the issues.
Long story short, we had a great time and my 08 F350 with some modifications is the right truck for the type of trips we do.
I'm back.
We've been on holidays with our truck and trailer since August 2nd.
We had an awesome, awesome time. So much to see and do ! We love the water and we swam or were on our kayaks every day except 2 travel days. Everyone has a great tan and a big smile. We were all exhausted when we got home.
Swap wise, it was very motivating to see how much fun we had and how much everyone enjoyed themselves. This is why we have a truck and a trailer and improving the truck with a swap will only make our trips better. We are hoping to do another long trip in March. I can't wait.
We traveled about 2700 miles in all on this trip, with lots of mountain driving. I lost track of how many mountain passes we went over.
This was the first time I towed with my truck in the mountains. Overall, it worked well. I'm glad that I got to use it stock before I did the swap, but it sure would have been nice to have had the swap done for this trip.
My truck is still a terrible fuel pig. I didn't calculate any numbers, but 8 MPG is the norm in good conditions, less than that in the mountains. I am not driving it hard at all. I almost never cruise with the trailer at much over 60 MPH. And I was feathering the throttle when climbing. Its incredible how much fuel this thing uses. I wouldn't believe it myself if I wasn't seeing it first hand.
Power is OK, but there were a lot of mountain climbs where I was down to 40 MPH and there were several times that I was down to 25-30 MPH when climbing.
I didn't let the engine wind out at 3,000 RPM when climbing. When it downshifted to full engine RPM, I took it off of cruise control and feathered the throttle to run the engine about 2600 RPM. More engine speed than that just created more fan noise and probably used more fuel.
I was surprised how often the fan was running. Even when we were travelling at night with temps in the 70s the fan was almost always on when climbing. With my '99 (5.9 CR and no fan shroud) the fan almost never comes one. I think I've only heard it come on half a dozen times ever. It will be interesting to see how much the fan runs with the 6.7.
Handling wise, my truck tows our trailer like a dream. Twisty mountain passes are no problem and the truck always feels in control. The ride is much improved with the Bilstein 5160s, to the point that its almost plush with the trailer behind. Its still rough when empty, but the 5160s helped a lot.
The limit slip in the rear diff still makes some noise and chatters once in a while, but its much better than it used to be. Its like my '99 now.
Axle wrap is a problem with these trucks. They have longer rear leaf springs than the pre 08s. In one campground I had to start out on a steep gravel hill with the trailer behind. It took three attemps to get going without tearing the drivetrain out due to axle hop.
The 5R110 is a mixed blessing. I think the transmission itself is great. I can see why people like it. It always seems to shift well, no matter what the conditions.
I think the torque converter is way too mushy and isn't locked nearly enough, especially in lower gears in Tow-Haul mode.
I love the engine braking in Tow-Haul mode, but its big pain in the butt and a serious misuse of brakes that the only way to "manually" engage engine braking is to stab the brakes hard.
The 5R110 would be a totally different transmission if it was manually controlled like the 6R140 can be.
I still think that 3rd gear should have been faster. It sucks to have to keep the speed down to 60 MPH or so when engine braking in 3rd gear to keep the engine RPMs below 3,000.
Overall, I used the truck/trailer brakes way more with the 5R110 than I would have with a ZF6. I am really looking forward to having manual control of the 6R140.
The kids LOVED the DVD player.
The Ford 08 Nav system totally sucks. In the course of our travels, navigation issues probably cost us 8 hours of travel time in total. It will be replaced before out next long trip.
I've upgraded the nav system in my truck with pretty much the latest maps. The maps are fine, content wise. They are pretty much always right for an area. However, on an 08 there is no practical way to zoom in and out significantly and there is no way to scroll to see more of the area around where you currently are, other than what is on the screen.
The big problem with the 08 nav system is routing. The routing is TERRIBLE. The routes it selects are not wrong. They will get you there. Its just that it always seems to select a very slow, congested way to get to the destination. I've tried changing several of the routing options in setup, but the behavior is always the same. I suspect its going for the shortest route at all costs rather than the fastest route.
Instead of taking a freeway to get within a mile of the destination, the GPS will instruct you to turn off 10 miles before the destination and take side streets the rest of the way. Sometimes its obvious that the route is wrong, but sometimes it isn't. Its the later that causes the problem.
We came to rely on using a map in conjunction with the GPS to get where we were going. Generally we used the map to make the big route decisions on how to get 90% of the way there and then used the GPS to guide us the rest of the way. Getting on the right freeway and taking the right freeway exit solved 90% of the issues.
Long story short, we had a great time and my 08 F350 with some modifications is the right truck for the type of trips we do.
A Ford crew cab truck is 35 inches longer than a regular cab truck. A Dodge Quad Cab truck is 26 inches longer. That makes the Ford crew cab extension 9 inches longer than the Dodge Quad Cab.
But all this is mostly irrelevant. See my next post on cab extensions.
bad12jr
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I was just looking to see if you updated not 30 mins ago. I'm very interested in the 5160s. Seems like a good review to me as I'm not gonna pull near that weight but the adjustabilty is nice.
Glad the ride is better. Should be a caddie when you get the air ride done. Would definanlty be interested in the rear bag setup.
Sent from my x2 somewhere
Glad the ride is better. Should be a caddie when you get the air ride done. Would definanlty be interested in the rear bag setup.
Sent from my x2 somewhere
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The elephant in the room.
I haven't been talking about it, but it was driven home during our trip and it needs to be addressed, so here it is.
The cab on my F350 is too small. It needs to be extended.
Our F350 seats 5 people. There were 5 of us and our dog on this trip. We were mostly very comfortable while travelling except the person sitting in the middle in the back seat doesn't have a headrest, which makes it difficult to nap in that position. It would also be nice if the back seat(s) reclined a bit for more comfort.
Our trailer sleeps 10 people. We don't intend to take 10 people on trips, but we do want to take more than 5 people and we are planning to have another child. Our truck needs more seats. There is no way around it.
We took 2 vehicles on one camping trip in July. That works for small trips close to home, but it doesn't work on our long adventure trips. It isn't just to and from the destination that needs 2 vehicles, its all the side trips that happen while we are at the destination. And its way nicer to have 2 parents in one vehicle managing kids when travelling long distances than to have 1 parent in 2 vehicles each having to manage kids.
And it isn't just the camping and adventure trips where we are having this problem. Its weekend trips around home and ski trips in the winter.
We've discussed this several times. Seating capacity aside, our truck works great. But we'll probably need to take at least 2 more people along on our trip next summer and just about every family trip we make as long as keep the truck.
My wife and I have discussed going to a travel trailer and pulling it with an Excursion. We've also discussed MDTs and HDTs. I even chatted with a few MDT owners. We've also discussed motorhomes. We don't want any of those solutions.
So I've started looking at extending the cab on my F350. Its a crew cab long box. The wheelbase is 172 ish inches.
Addng another crew cab section to the existing cab would add 35 ish inches to the cab.
Adding a Super Cab section to the existing cab would add 16ish inches to the cab.
Converting from a long box to a short box would free up 16 ish inches of space on the frame.
No matter what, the frame on my truck (any Ford truck) needs to be cut and welded to accept a cab extension. This is because it rises behind the cab to support the under side of the box. Thus the lowered, under the cab, portion of the frame needs to be extended no matter what cab extension is added.
I ran into a guy who extended his crew cab with a supercab section. He loves it except that he feels its too small to allow for comfort while travelling long distances. I think most people feel that way about the rear seat in Supercabs.
I don't want to extend the wheel base of my truck any more than I have to. If I added a Supercab extension and swapped from a long box to a short box, I wouldn't have to change the wheel base at all. If I went with a full crew cab extension, I'd have to lengthen the wheelbase by 19 inches and lose the long box that I love so much. I feel that increasing the wheelbase by 19 inches is too much.
The "best" solution I have come up with thus far is to add 8 inches to the doors and cab section of a Supercab extension. That would require an 8 inch increase in wheel base and swapping the long box for a short box. That would give the rear seat am extension length of 24 inches, which is approaching the rear seat extension in a Quad cab.
Then there is the issue of matching the interior trim.
My truck is a King Ranch. To my knowledge, you can not get the King Ranch trim in a Super Cab truck. So there are no King Ranch rear seats or trim panels for a Super Cab extension, especially not one lengthened 8 inches.
All this leaves me with a headache. I am presently discussing my options with a nearby company that has done a few cab extensions.
Why am I discussing all this now and what does it have to do with the swap ?
I don't want to swap the 6.7 into my truck and then realize it wasn't the right truck for our needs.
I've known about the impending cab space issue for a while, but always thought that we could "make due". Our recent trip drove home the fact that "making due" would be more painful that I realized and that our trips are probably going to be more frequent that I realized. The cab issue needs to be addressed.
When I think about it, this project is starting to get ludicrous. The "To Do" list reads
- engine/transmission swap
- front and rear suspension upgrades
- cab extension and box swap.
That is a lot of work. Is it really necessary ?
I keep thinking that surely there must be some other way to do this.
But there is no way we want to give up or 5th wheel trailer. Its way too nice to travel and stay in when we are on our adventure trips. Its what makes going on these trips feasible and comfortable. There is something to be said for getting a good night's sleep every night while away from home and having all your gear along and organized.
So we need a vehicle to pull the 5er and it needs to seat more than 5 people. The easiest way I can see to do that is to extend the cab on a Superduty truck.
At this point its not too late for me to change my mind about doing the swap and/or the truck entirely and going a different route. It seems extreme (to me) to do all this work on a stock truck to get a vehicle that works for us and yet it also seems to be the easiest (and by far the cheapest) way to do it.
I need to come to grips with a few things about the cab extension before moving ahead with the swap. It shouldn't take long as I have calls in to a couple people familiar with doing them.
I haven't been talking about it, but it was driven home during our trip and it needs to be addressed, so here it is.
The cab on my F350 is too small. It needs to be extended.
Our F350 seats 5 people. There were 5 of us and our dog on this trip. We were mostly very comfortable while travelling except the person sitting in the middle in the back seat doesn't have a headrest, which makes it difficult to nap in that position. It would also be nice if the back seat(s) reclined a bit for more comfort.
Our trailer sleeps 10 people. We don't intend to take 10 people on trips, but we do want to take more than 5 people and we are planning to have another child. Our truck needs more seats. There is no way around it.
We took 2 vehicles on one camping trip in July. That works for small trips close to home, but it doesn't work on our long adventure trips. It isn't just to and from the destination that needs 2 vehicles, its all the side trips that happen while we are at the destination. And its way nicer to have 2 parents in one vehicle managing kids when travelling long distances than to have 1 parent in 2 vehicles each having to manage kids.
And it isn't just the camping and adventure trips where we are having this problem. Its weekend trips around home and ski trips in the winter.
We've discussed this several times. Seating capacity aside, our truck works great. But we'll probably need to take at least 2 more people along on our trip next summer and just about every family trip we make as long as keep the truck.
My wife and I have discussed going to a travel trailer and pulling it with an Excursion. We've also discussed MDTs and HDTs. I even chatted with a few MDT owners. We've also discussed motorhomes. We don't want any of those solutions.
So I've started looking at extending the cab on my F350. Its a crew cab long box. The wheelbase is 172 ish inches.
Addng another crew cab section to the existing cab would add 35 ish inches to the cab.
Adding a Super Cab section to the existing cab would add 16ish inches to the cab.
Converting from a long box to a short box would free up 16 ish inches of space on the frame.
No matter what, the frame on my truck (any Ford truck) needs to be cut and welded to accept a cab extension. This is because it rises behind the cab to support the under side of the box. Thus the lowered, under the cab, portion of the frame needs to be extended no matter what cab extension is added.
I ran into a guy who extended his crew cab with a supercab section. He loves it except that he feels its too small to allow for comfort while travelling long distances. I think most people feel that way about the rear seat in Supercabs.
I don't want to extend the wheel base of my truck any more than I have to. If I added a Supercab extension and swapped from a long box to a short box, I wouldn't have to change the wheel base at all. If I went with a full crew cab extension, I'd have to lengthen the wheelbase by 19 inches and lose the long box that I love so much. I feel that increasing the wheelbase by 19 inches is too much.
The "best" solution I have come up with thus far is to add 8 inches to the doors and cab section of a Supercab extension. That would require an 8 inch increase in wheel base and swapping the long box for a short box. That would give the rear seat am extension length of 24 inches, which is approaching the rear seat extension in a Quad cab.
Then there is the issue of matching the interior trim.
My truck is a King Ranch. To my knowledge, you can not get the King Ranch trim in a Super Cab truck. So there are no King Ranch rear seats or trim panels for a Super Cab extension, especially not one lengthened 8 inches.
All this leaves me with a headache. I am presently discussing my options with a nearby company that has done a few cab extensions.
Why am I discussing all this now and what does it have to do with the swap ?
I don't want to swap the 6.7 into my truck and then realize it wasn't the right truck for our needs.
I've known about the impending cab space issue for a while, but always thought that we could "make due". Our recent trip drove home the fact that "making due" would be more painful that I realized and that our trips are probably going to be more frequent that I realized. The cab issue needs to be addressed.
When I think about it, this project is starting to get ludicrous. The "To Do" list reads
- engine/transmission swap
- front and rear suspension upgrades
- cab extension and box swap.
That is a lot of work. Is it really necessary ?
I keep thinking that surely there must be some other way to do this.
But there is no way we want to give up or 5th wheel trailer. Its way too nice to travel and stay in when we are on our adventure trips. Its what makes going on these trips feasible and comfortable. There is something to be said for getting a good night's sleep every night while away from home and having all your gear along and organized.
So we need a vehicle to pull the 5er and it needs to seat more than 5 people. The easiest way I can see to do that is to extend the cab on a Superduty truck.
At this point its not too late for me to change my mind about doing the swap and/or the truck entirely and going a different route. It seems extreme (to me) to do all this work on a stock truck to get a vehicle that works for us and yet it also seems to be the easiest (and by far the cheapest) way to do it.
I need to come to grips with a few things about the cab extension before moving ahead with the swap. It shouldn't take long as I have calls in to a couple people familiar with doing them.
Just to be clear, the 5160s are not manually adjustable. You have to disassemble them to change the valving.
Actually, its a lot better.
Up front, I think its pretty much dialed in with the 5160s. I'm not sure if I'll put the front on air now or not, its that good. I'll re-evaluate it after the rear axle is on air.
In the back, things are pretty good with the trailer behind. Its still a bit jolting if you hit a big dip (I call them whoops) in the road. But much better than stock and pretty much perfect other than that. With the stock shocks you felt every bump you heard. Now you hear bumps but don't feel a lot of them.
Empty, the harsh "bang" is gone from the rear axle when going over sharp jolts. Its much more plush. But on certain highway bumps at speed there is some chatter after the bump, like the axle is hopping. That shakes the cab a bit. Empty, I suspect the rear shocks could use a bit more rebound damping, which might help with the trailer going through whoops as well.
FWIW, the 5160s are a lot better than the 5100s when empty. I'm not sure about when towing.
The air suspension on my '99 with the 5100s is about the same as my 08 with 5160s when empty. I blame that on the 5100s, which are too harsh, especially near the end of their stroke. Here the reservoir really seems to help the 5160s, which never seem harsh.
The air suspension on my '99 with the 5100s is super plush when towing, even with the whoops. I credit this to the air bags, which seem to soak everything up, big or small and the 5100s do a good job of controlling the motion. I suspect the 5100s and 5160s would be about the same when towing.
I need to look up the damping rates on both my 5100s and 5160s and see how they compare.
At this point I would buy 5160s over 5100s, no contest.
I'm still trying to figure out the torque control aspect of putting the rear axle on air.
My latest thinking is to use the leaf springs to hold the axle side to side and have an upper torque arm attached from the top of the diff to the frame crossmember and have 2 lower torque arms attached under the axle tubes to the bottom of the frame. All torque arms would have bushings in both ends.
The only problem I see with doing that is getting the arc of the torque arms to match the arc the axle wants to travel with the leaf spring. I'm wondering if it would work to put a shackle at both ends of the leaf spring to allow fore aft movement so the axle can easily follow the arc of the torque arms.
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Bustedknuckles
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Have you considered just buying a mega cab dodge with a 6.7? Obviously building what you have in mind would be awesime but is going to require tons of time and money and some custom parts that are not going to be readily available if you break down in the middle of nowhere.....
bad12jr
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For the last time he doesn't want a Dodge. And the only non stock parts are the trans controller and adapter plates. Everything else is OEM.
Sent from my x2 somewhere
Sent from my x2 somewhere
Hotrodtractor
Moderator
You can simply remove the springs alltogether and use a pair of radius arms and a panhard bar for side to side location. Or do the same with 4 links instead of radius arms. If you just want to use the leaf springs with some air helper bags you could just add a set of single axle mount traction bars and let the combination of the spring and the traction bar control your wrap.
Sure you could put a shackle on each end of the leaf spring - but that is a TON of work.
Keep in mind that I am not opposed to the "ton of work" option.
