61 mm vs. 64 mm billet

[RedRice589]

Are there dyno sheets with these overlayed? It would make this much easier.

Does the streetmax come up slow enough to smoke before it lights? I wouldn't want any more smoke than I get when I step on it with my stock '11 turbo

Since I think I have the most time with a billet 61mm I'll come in here and say there is low end smoke to deal with. It's not hard at all to drive around. I need tuning revisions I have not gotten yet though. I'm running canned tunes because I haven't gotten with gearhead. But it will puff and then clear up 100%

Not exactly sure how much time MikeS has with these trucks with big chargers, but KEM has dozens of hours with my 11 w/ a 61mm & Morgan's 15 w/ a 64 live tuning and dialing in for driveability

I will say any 11-14 truck with even a stock turbo 15 retrofit can benefit greatly from custom tuning. Mine has a powerband like a race tuned LML, only cleaner, and stronger

Agreed. Mine pulls all day long and gets driven hard everyday. It made all the difference towing and WOT. He'll even in town it lights fast and pulls nicely but not too much you have to let off.

Here's the problem. Your getting input from guys that flat foot ALOT and are big HP boys in general. Alittle lag doesn't mean much to them.

If your looking for an easy smooth transition the 61 will be your best option. Whether you go billet or not.

I like the 61mm I have but I'd also go for the 64mm now that I have it and I trust Morgan to say the 64mm spools a touch slower. Mine lights fast.

Ok, let me make this very clear. Any time you go from a stock 11-14 charger to any 2015 charger there is a big dead spot down low. That is not the turbo. That is the tuning. The 11-14 vane control is way off with a 2015. Can you drive it, yes. Will it be anything like your stock turbo, no.

With tuning we change the tables to mimic a 2015. When that is done they spool as good as a new 2015. Which if anyone has any real seat time will tell you does not spool quite as fast as the tiny baby 11-14 turbo. But it's way better than even a 6.4 with stock chargers.

The 61mm TowMax spools better than a stock 2015 charger. The StreetMax is a tadd lazier. Even with a 1410 pw race tune it was nearly impossible to make the StreetMax smoke. It is still a small turbo. On a 6.7 you are talking a 100 rpm difference at best over stock. So stock starts making boost at 1200 this makes at 1300. I could make 15 psi at less than 1500 rpm with the 64mm. I don't think spool is an issue. I'm picky, very picky about what I drive. You talking about slighty modified stock turbos. Not s400's... Spool is very very minimally affected. But to get best results vgt tuning to mimic a 2015 is a must for any. Has nothing to do with the compressor size of the turbo.

I would make all my turbos StreetMax but I have the TowMax as a cheaper lower hp turbo just to give guys a nice alternative to the stock cast turbo. It's not really a driveability difference. It's a power and cost ratio more than anything.

So please, understand I am not a "big power" guy. Don't ever say a non vgt is so great to drive. I would take a 64mm over an s300 any day of the week. I've done a lot of this testing to try to help you guys with real world scenarios. I have no issue sending my 80 year old grandfather out in my 2015 or my wife who knows nothing about trucks or how modified ones drive. I never turned it down. Never changed the tune. They drive so close to stock that it's not an issue.

Just letting you know the real facts from someone who's not guessing. I know them both because I built them. I've drove them extensively. They are both good turbos. If you don't really care about max power but would be satisfied with a nice hp bump and the added reliability then go TowMax. But for the person that wants to run with hot tuned 6.4's I would say 100% you need a StreetMax and a bigger pump than a 2011-14 has. That's gonna get you 600hp 6.4 type power with a big tune.


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There's no little faces so I cans stick my tongue out at you. LOL :hammer:

not sure how you'll ever know if you like a set-up without driving or riding in a truck with it, but maybe these videos I just shot can give you an idea of daily driveability?

Truck is ccsb, 4x4. 3.31 gears, 35.1" tall tires, 2015 turbo, stock 2012 HPFP, stock exhaust with delete pipe only, no limit cai, egr deleted, GearHead tuning

Minimaxx parameters shown are: boost - egt - pulse width - throttle position


Locked in 6th at ~70mph just to show responsiveness. While I'd love to go 100% throttle for you, I like my rods

http://youtu.be/EVDYVx8ZMmQ

normal stop light start with traffic flow 25-35% throttle max

http://youtu.be/YDBZoRpYT8M

rolling stop light with traffic flow 25-35% throttle max

http://youtu.be/MzwSTH89idc

simulated kick-down pass at 60mph 42% throttle max to get it to drop a gear

http://youtu.be/TNDsfzN5GH4

Floor it in 6th candy azz... I've done it with 17k behind me.... Locked in 6Th on HOT lol

This is pretty much the issue I've had all along... There doesn't seem to be any consistent opinion on what the right turbo would be. I haven't driven a truck with either turbo, so I really have no idea which way to go. The cost difference from the 61 to the 64 isn't much, but making the wrong choice, and having to buy the other after a while would suck.....

64mm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nothing wrong with either... And I have 30k on mine already.

Alot of good info. in this thread........

Isn't it past your bedtime grandpa...??

The billet 61 sounds like a great upgrade, but is there really much to gain when running a mild tow tune? I'm tuned and deleted and pull 15-18,000 with my dually on 35's (3.73's). I can see the obvious gains when you're maxing the turbo out on a hot tune, but is there much benefit for my application? Will it move enough air to let me run more power and keep EGT's in check or am I simply upgrading from a reliability stand point of not having a failure prone turbo?

I'm still on the fence whether I should do gears (4.30's) or the turbos.

Turbo turbo turbo. For you I'd say 61mm... I wish you were closer I'd hook my truck to your trailer and hand you the keys.... And I'd say that to any one of you that's concerned. Put 20k lbs behind my truck and take it for a spin.... Even on no power it pulls strong and never falters. I run one bump up just because I can. And it's awesome.

 

[RedRice589]

Morgan you want to dig up those crappy vids I took when I got mine on or do I need to take new ones?

 

[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

You are the king of multi quote..... Sugar


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[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

I've taken plenty of vids but there is just something you can't get from a video.


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[RedRice589]

You are the king of multi quote..... Sugar


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Lol very true. Anybody wants a test drive mine sits next fo the barn haha

 

[CATDiezel]

Redrice589. Judging by what you say alot regarding towing. I'm assuming your ALWAYS towing??

 

[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

If I'm not mistaken he tows his home to different locations for work. And hauls horses for his line of work. Basically tows a lot.


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[Gearhead]

I believe he will be trying out a new charger configuration. He'll report back.

 

[Powerstroked162]

If I'm not mistaken he tows his home to different locations for work. And hauls horses for his line of work. Basically tows a lot.


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Matchstick madness

 

[Motostroker]

Steve is sending me a 64 street max, his waste gate kit, Morgan's y pipe kit, and I'll be installing a 2015 pump. I'll conduct some testing for you guys. I tow all the time like Adam, and heavy.

This camper is 21k by itself.

I'll report back with videos of spool up, ebp/boost ratio, etc. This will help our decision!


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[RedRice589]

Redrice589. Judging by what you say alot regarding towing. I'm assuming your ALWAYS towing??

Well since I can only drive because it's work related (license restrictions LOL) pretty much. I have no use for a truck if it's not hooked to the trailer.... Got a mustang for grocery duties..... Have 107k miles on the truck with 75% hooked to a trailer. Or going to get a trailer. I have two trailers that don't register on my dash settings lol

 

[RedRice589]

If I'm not mistaken he tows his home to different locations for work. And hauls horses for his line of work. Basically tows a lot.


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Exactly.... My seats are comfy!

I believe he will be trying out a new charger configuration. He'll report back.

I could use to reply to your email lol

Matchstick madness

Shut up #whitegurlwastedyouare

Steve is sending me a 64 street max, his waste gate kit, Morgan's y pipe kit, and I'll be installing a 2015 pump. I'll conduct some testing for you guys. I tow all the time like Adam, and heavy.

This camper is 21k by itself.

I'll report back with videos of spool up, ebp/boost ratio, etc. This will help our decision!


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Mines better and I didn't compensate with a platinum..... oke:

My house is 42' long and I tow any of 3 different horse trailers. 4,6,9 horse slants. The 9 horse trailer itself weighs 7800 empty lol I can't out 9 horses on it.

 

[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

I believe he will be trying out a new charger configuration. He'll report back.

Who?


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[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

Maxxedout, if your on the fence, go test drive a 2015. If your okay with how it drives then you will be more than happy with either turbo. When tuned and deleted the 61mm spools faster than factory cast. And the 64mm spools like I said maybe 100 rpm less at the most. These are still factory style vgt turbos. They spool like factory. Kinda like splitting hairs on driveability between the two. Either or will be the best driving aftermarket turbo there is for a 6.7. Any non-vgt will have more lag (although they are simpler and make more power). So if you drive a 2015 you will have a very good idea of what your looking at when you do a retrofit.


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[maxxedout]

Who?


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I am... I won't get into too many details at the moment, but I'm going to be testing something based off a 2015 charger, but with a few more modifications than most of the other chargers out there at the moment.

 

[maxxedout]

Maxxedout, if your on the fence, go test drive a 2015. If your okay with how it drives then you will be more than happy with either turbo. When tuned and deleted the 61mm spools faster than factory cast. And the 64mm spools like I said maybe 100 rpm less at the most. These are still factory style vgt turbos. They spool like factory. Kinda like splitting hairs on driveability between the two. Either or will be the best driving aftermarket turbo there is for a 6.7. Any non-vgt will have more lag (although they are simpler and make more power). So if you drive a 2015 you will have a very good idea of what your looking at when you do a retrofit.


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I've driven a couple 2015's now... Working for a Ford dealer has its benefits haha. The first one we got when they came out drove pretty well, but the most recent one I ordered for a customer seemed even quicker. Yeah, I could notice a difference in lag compared to a 11-14, but even in stock form, it wasn't bad. My rear tires would probably thank me if there was a little more lag than my stock 2012 charger.....

 

[Morgan@Midwest Diesel & Auto]

I am... I won't get into too many details at the moment, but I'm going to be testing something based off a 2015 charger, but with a few more modifications than most of the other chargers out there at the moment.

Ok, well good luck. Let us know when you get it going. Must be going larger than 64 then? So far that's the only reason I have found to go with a larger turbine.


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[jcain]

I am... I won't get into too many details at the moment, but I'm going to be testing something based off a 2015 charger, but with a few more modifications than most of the other chargers out there at the moment.

Then why this thread?

 

[maxxedout]

Then why this thread?

I was undecided about what to do at the time. I'll start a new thread once everything is up and running with the turbo I'm going with.

 

[jcain]

Any company can (try to) "mod" them. Choose wisely, as I've seen people "test" turbos for a company and end up wasting a motor on their own dime.