All I got to say..

TyCorr · Jul 27, 2012

golfer said:
back in '03 when I pitched a forged rod...it let go just tooling home at @ 30mph.

That engine had done 680rwhp on polished, peened and weight matched forged rods.

what typically happens is that the rod deforms, gets a little shorter...which allows the piston to come down "lower" in the bore than it would otherwise...which knocks off the piston oil cooling jets...

and evvvvvery forged rod that I've seen go...is always at the exact same point as those pictured here.

we wouldn't build a 450rwhp engine with forged rods...just too risky...there's a big difference in tossing 10g's worth of hot rod parts at a perfectly good forged rod engine...and going out and making 650+hp...but to spend all the time & money to BUILD an engine for that kind of power...without doing billet rods is reckless.

That makes sense to me.

DocBar · Jul 27, 2012

golfer said:
back in '03 when I pitched a forged rod...it let go just tooling home at @ 30mph.

That engine had done 680rwhp on polished, peened and weight matched forged rods.

what typically happens is that the rod deforms, gets a little shorter...which allows the piston to come down "lower" in the bore than it would otherwise...which knocks off the piston oil cooling jets...

and evvvvvery forged rod that I've seen go...is always at the exact same point as those pictured here.

we wouldn't build a 450rwhp engine with forged rods...just too risky...there's a big difference in tossing 10g's worth of hot rod parts at a perfectly good forged rod engine...and going out and making 650+hp...but to spend all the time & money to BUILD an engine for that kind of power...without doing billet rods is reckless.

Charles said:
Because 99.9999999999999% of the time that engine is running, it's not at WOT.

The chances of catastrophically breaking the engine are extremely low whenever the state of tune is even CLOSE to what the engine can handle.

If you're close on the setup, then you will be deflecting the rods, mains, block, heads and all else to points somewhere south of their yield strength (the point where the deflection doesn't come back to it's original shape when the load is removed). When it comes to connecting rods being pushed hard, you will be riiiiiight at the yield strength all the time when you're pushing on the engine. If you slip over it a bit, it's still not the end of the world. The rod bends a little, and in fact, I bet a ton of stock rodded engines have permanently deflected rods in them that were pushed beyond their yield previously, but that are still hanging in there fine.

The problem comes when the inertial loads try to straighten the rod back by accelerating the piston/pin/rings back down the bore over and over. This is where any fracture that may have happened when the rod was deformed past the yield strength will begin to grow. As the rod continues swinging around the crack will grow and grow and grow and grow. For a LONG, LONG time under most circumstances. In this case whenever you finally get that crack large enough the end of the rod finally plinks off and all hell breaks loose.

If the tune is close..... and a rod fails, then rest assured that the rod was fatally wounded a LONG.... LONG.... time before then. Depending on driving habbits, it could be days, weeks, months or even years...

A rod bent beyond yield in a 700hp engine could conceivably be put back to stock power and if the rpm were kept relatively low, it could run for years after being fatally wounded.

In fact.... the chances of putting an engine back together with rods that are already fractured is probably very high unless they are magnafluxed beforehand.

These two posts right here sum up what I've been trying to get right in my mind. I just hope my Crowers are up to the task when I get the compounds done.

fatsix · Jul 27, 2012

Charles said:
Because 99.9999999999999% of the time that engine is running, it's not at WOT.

The chances of catastrophically breaking the engine are extremely low whenever the state of tune is even CLOSE to what the engine can handle.

If you're close on the setup, then you will be deflecting the rods, mains, block, heads and all else to points somewhere south of their yield strength (the point where the deflection doesn't come back to it's original shape when the load is removed). When it comes to connecting rods being pushed hard, you will be riiiiiight at the yield strength all the time when you're pushing on the engine. If you slip over it a bit, it's still not the end of the world. The rod bends a little, and in fact, I bet a ton of stock rodded engines have permanently deflected rods in them that were pushed beyond their yield previously, but that are still hanging in there fine.

The problem comes when the inertial loads try to straighten the rod back by accelerating the piston/pin/rings back down the bore over and over. This is where any fracture that may have happened when the rod was deformed past the yield strength will begin to grow. As the rod continues swinging around the crack will grow and grow and grow and grow. For a LONG, LONG time under most circumstances. In this case whenever you finally get that crack large enough the end of the rod finally plinks off and all hell breaks loose.

If the tune is close..... and a rod fails, then rest assured that the rod was fatally wounded a LONG.... LONG.... time before then. Depending on driving habbits, it could be days, weeks, months or even years...

A rod bent beyond yield in a 700hp engine could conceivably be put back to stock power and if the rpm were kept relatively low, it could run for years after being fatally wounded.

In fact.... the chances of putting an engine back together with rods that are already fractured is probably very high unless they are magnafluxed beforehand.

Which is why rods are like women, they remember everything you do to them (Thanks Bret.)

Magnum PD · Jul 27, 2012

I'm gonna have to figure out how to buy billet rods.

MadDiesel73 · Jul 28, 2012

**** just got REAL! Thanks spongebob you the man! Ill see u tomorrow with the core cam.

2002FordPwr · Jul 28, 2012

:drool::drool::drool:

DocBar · Jul 28, 2012

MD, good luck with the rebuild. Those are some nice looking rods.

fatsix · Jul 28, 2012

MadDiesel73 said:
**** just got REAL! Thanks spongebob you the man! Ill see u tomorrow with the core cam.

You gotta change your Signature now. Very nice.

I am jealous. Hopefully this fixes the issue permanently and just doesn't move on to the next weakest link. I am hoping it does, because I will be in jumping into your old boat for the meantime. I just spent a large chunk of the budget on the trans and the truck still needs to go back together.

OSCS · Jul 28, 2012

Docbar, who's doing your work now?

DocBar · Jul 28, 2012

OSCS said:
Docbar, who's doing your work now?

I'm gonna add the GQSSB and injectors myself. I'm still studying on the atmospheric. I added a cowl induction hood on my truck that gives me a couple of extra inches to play with, so I'm trying to cover all my bases, talk to guys that have experience with these setups and then decide how and where I want to put the LP turbo.

Matt will be tuning truck. If I decide to mount it myself, Jeff Garmon has said he'd bend the plumbing for me if I get him the dimensions.

OSCS · Jul 28, 2012

DocBar said:
I'm gonna add the GQSSB and injectors myself. I'm still studying on the atmospheric. I added a cowl induction hood on my truck that gives me a couple of extra inches to play with, so I'm trying to cover all my bases, talk to guys that have experience with these setups and then decide how and where I want to put the LP turbo.

Matt will be tuning truck. If I decide to mount it myself, Jeff Garmon has said he'd bend the plumbing for me if I get him the dimensions.

right on

Charles · Jul 30, 2012

DocBar said:
I'm gonna add the GQSSB and injectors myself. I'm still studying on the atmospheric. I added a cowl induction hood on my truck that gives me a couple of extra inches to play with, so I'm trying to cover all my bases, talk to guys that have experience with these setups and then decide how and where I want to put the LP turbo.

Matt will be tuning truck. If I decide to mount it myself, Jeff Garmon has said he'd bend the plumbing for me if I get him the dimensions.

You're messing around down at Garmons? lol.

I might have to drive down there and give you boys some sh*t. Jeff likes to give me hell about my old powerstroke anyway.

DocBar · Jul 30, 2012

Charles said:
You're messing around down at Garmons? lol.

I might have to drive down there and give you boys some sh*t. Jeff likes to give me hell about my old powerstroke anyway.

I hit Jefrf up about helping me install the compound setup. He wasn't interested but did say he could bend the plumbing for me. He's a nice enough guy but definitely all about the Cummins.

You're more than welcome to pitch in on the compound install....

MadDiesel73 · Jul 30, 2012

Got the rods,stg1 cam,total seals, coated bearings, post pump filter,fuel bowl delete,oem waterpump , stealth dual hpop's, dieselsite resivior adapter, swamps 400/200's , gettin the piston bowls cut and possibly coated.. Now for the waiting game.. 3-4 weeks..

BlueScab · Jul 30, 2012

MadDiesel73 said:
Got the rods,stg1 cam,total seals, coated bearings, post pump filter,fuel bowl delete,oem waterpump , stealth dual hpop's, dieselsite resivior adapter, swamps 400/200's , gettin the piston bowls cut and possibly coated.. Now for the waiting game.. 3-4 weeks..

I've probally overlooked it , but are you using factory ford pistons?

MadDiesel73 · Jul 30, 2012

Mahle's not too many options out there. I got the mahles from swamps are they same as oem?

BlueScab · Jul 30, 2012

I thought they were then I found a set of Mahles for 2300 bucks that were supposed to be upgrades from stock. Truck should be amazing when get it back together.:ford: