Bulit 6.4 HG problems???

Powerstroked162

On Da Juice
Joined
May 18, 2011
Messages
10,069
Reaction score
0
Location
Wa. State
These heads were just checked and hardened seats etc..installed 7K miles ago. Not saying they are not cracked, but I would think elite would have caught that.


Cracked block only cause puking under heavy load? Has to be other symptoms then just puking with a cracked block?

I'm gonna guess they were magnafluxed before clean up and probably passed. Machined, installed, and with a little bad luck and a lot of pedal, cracked after install. 6.4 heads suck. I'm seriously considering having mine ceramic coated like Clausen's truck, just to add comfort.

Cracked block should be mixing coolant. Call it... Your own personal milkshake machine. And those milkshakes do not bring the boys to the yard lol

.
 

co04cobra

Active member
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
3,003
Reaction score
10
Location
WV
I had a head crack after 5k miles...they also had hardened seats...thats my guess for you aswell



I held out buying a 6.4 for a long time b/c of all the issues. I waited until a "built" one came up for sale thinking it was a safer bet. :doh:


Where or what did you have to do to get a set of heads to hold up? Then there is the whole other issue with cracked blocks, that seems to come out after installing the studs the 2nd time, right?


Should I just contact elite about the heads?
 

co04cobra

Active member
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
3,003
Reaction score
10
Location
WV
I'm gonna guess they were magnafluxed before clean up and probably passed. Machined, installed, and with a little bad luck and a lot of pedal, cracked after install. 6.4 heads suck. I'm seriously considering having mine ceramic coated like Clausen's truck, just to add comfort.

Cracked block should be mixing coolant. Call it... Your own personal milkshake machine. And those milkshakes do not bring the boys to the yard lol

.



Yea, oil is clean. If ceramic coating has helped them last seems like a person would be crazy not to do it on a build.
 

suprdzlduty

Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2012
Messages
423
Reaction score
0
Location
Prospect, Oh
If it is puking, then it it is head gaskets...let's not forget common sense. 6.4's are not exactly known for strength...I would look at front cover if the oil is mixing with the coolant...figure this...6.4 is usually heads down...as in bottom end...what I've found is the crank has a hard time keeping bearings...just sayin...but if it's puking don't rule out the obvious...
 

White_monster

Active member
Joined
May 19, 2011
Messages
3,177
Reaction score
1
Location
The great white north
If it is puking, then it it is head gaskets...let's not forget common sense. 6.4's are not exactly known for strength...I would look at front cover if the oil is mixing with the coolant...figure this...6.4 is usually heads down...as in bottom end...what I've found is the crank has a hard time keeping bearings...just sayin...but if it's puking don't rule out the obvious...

Where do you get your info from? A cracked head will cause puking if it's cracked in the combustion chamber to the cooling passage and it's happened lots. The bottom ends are fine but the bearings will fail if you leave the emissions crap on due to filling the crankcase with fuel and diluting the oil. I think you should research your info a bit more cause stock trucks and tuned trucks are not even the same beast in terms of parts failures.
 

Jbenso127

New member
Joined
Sep 2, 2012
Messages
1,382
Reaction score
0
Location
Centrallll Florida
Where do you get your info from? A cracked head will cause puking if it's cracked in the combustion chamber to the cooling passage and it's happened lots. The bottom ends are fine but the bearings will fail if you leave the emissions crap on due to filling the crankcase with fuel and diluting the oil. I think you should research your info a bit more cause stock trucks and tuned trucks are not even the same beast in terms of parts failures.

Glad somebody addressed that asinine post.
 

sootie

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 3, 2012
Messages
11,853
Reaction score
37
I held out buying a 6.4 for a long time b/c of all the issues. I waited until a "built" one came up for sale thinking it was a safer bet. :doh:


Where or what did you have to do to get a set of heads to hold up? Then there is the whole other issue with cracked blocks, that seems to come out after installing the studs the 2nd time, right?


Should I just contact elite about the heads?

my block cracked on the first head stud install. typically a block just mixes coolant, it doesn't make it puke. puking usually is head related whether it be cracked or gaskets.
 

co04cobra

Active member
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
3,003
Reaction score
10
Location
WV
Finally got to run a gauge on the truck this evening on the ride home.

Pressure went up slowly for the first 10mi or so as I wasn't running the truck hard until it warmed up.

At around 185ect I ran it past 40lbs of boost and the gauge jumped and climbed quickly up to around 16psi.

I then cruised between 65-75mph staying between 10-20 on boost. The pressure in the degas bottle stayed between 13-16psi.


Before getting home I ran it fairly hard, around 3/4 throttle, up to around 50lbs of boost and the pressure in the tank would go up to around 20psi, but seemed to level out and fall back down slightly.

Some of this maybe because I couldn't stay into the throttle any longer.

All these readings were with never having the WG open (going to 60lbs boost) and never above 1300* on egts. Ects and Eots always stay within a degree or two of each other 198-202 range.
 

webb06

Active member
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Messages
3,892
Reaction score
12
Location
Seneca, MO
Finally got to run a gauge on the truck this evening on the ride home.

Pressure went up slowly for the first 10mi or so as I wasn't running the truck hard until it warmed up.

At around 185ect I ran it past 40lbs of boost and the gauge jumped and climbed quickly up to around 16psi.

I then cruised between 65-75mph staying between 10-20 on boost. The pressure in the degas bottle stayed between 13-16psi.


Before getting home I ran it fairly hard, around 3/4 throttle, up to around 50lbs of boost and the pressure in the tank would go up to around 20psi, but seemed to level out and fall back down slightly.

Some of this maybe because I couldn't stay into the throttle any longer.

All these readings were with never having the WG open (going to 60lbs boost) and never above 1300* on egts. Ects and Eots always stay within a degree or two of each other 198-202 range.

Pressure in the cooling system shouldn't exceed like 12psi. You've got something going on.
 

co04cobra

Active member
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
3,003
Reaction score
10
Location
WV
Im pretty positive these were OEM also. I have to give elite a call on Wednesday.
 

co04cobra

Active member
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
3,003
Reaction score
10
Location
WV
Sucks, hope its nothing too bad.

Andy...Whats been up man!?


Yea I bought this thing built because I don't have the time to be working on my own stuff. Didn't get 1500mi out of it before doing....whatever happened. :doh:


Just think all the abuse the poor ol 7.3 has taken for the last 5yrs. :toast:


Ill try and get the cab off and motor out sometime this winter I guess. The truck really is a lot of fun on the street, but I can't be pulling the motor in between oil changes.

You still have your 6.4?
 

a_moore

Active member
Joined
May 22, 2011
Messages
354
Reaction score
34
Location
Blowing in the wind
Andy...Whats been up man!?


Yea I bought this thing built because I don't have the time to be working on my own stuff. Didn't get 1500mi out of it before doing....whatever happened. :doh:


Just think all the abuse the poor ol 7.3 has taken for the last 5yrs. :toast:


Ill try and get the cab off and motor out sometime this winter I guess. The truck really is a lot of fun on the street, but I can't be pulling the motor in between oil changes.

You still have your 6.4?

Yea Man, 190K miles and all is well.
 

Wayne

Active member
Joined
May 23, 2011
Messages
2,540
Reaction score
8
Location
Twin Falls, Idaho
I was just directed to this thread, and feel inclined to offer a little insight as I put it together. This whole deal building the truck was a pretty costly learning experience for Elite at the time starting with a miscommunication of sorts with our machinist, and the valve seat cutting process. This is the only set of Elite heads I'm aware of this ever happening to. The potential future problem has since been 100% resolved with a new design & process for seat install (improved design for everyone purchasing since that time) The machinist swore he cut them the same depth as he always did, but ended up barely, or almost cutting into the water jackets, which we didn't figure out until test driving when the motor would puff a little coolant smoke on start-up, then run clean, and be great aside from about 1-2 qt loss of coolant every 150 miles or so. Maybe it was a casting flaw, maybe not, but those heads were scrapped.

We didn't figure it out until I pulled the turbos to find moisture in the up pipes. I then pulled the exhaust manifolds, and with the system pressurized, saw coolant coming out of an exhaust port. After the heads were off, we found the leak right at 1 seat on one head, and at 2 on the other. New heads were put on, and shortly after, it started mixing coolant in the oil. This is when I discovered coolant coming up past the head stud threads.

We Teflon coated the leaky ones at the bases, and drove it a little more. If was only using a tiny bit of coolant, (no more from the stud tops) but using it none the less. Time for a new block.

We built an entirely new engine, being extra careful on everything to make it perfect. Here's where the details get a bit fuzzy... iirc, we went back to the old torque spec of 195 lb/ft on the head studs to minimize the possibility of cracks. We tested the truck thoroughly for a couple hundred miles more to be 100% certain that everything was as it should be, and it was.

If I were to guess the problem, I'd say the 195 I think I did just wasn't quite enough to keep the heads seated fully. You might try to go in and re-torque them up a little more (my own opinion, not authorized by Elite) , say 210ish, and run it for a bit to see what happens. Once you lift a head, unfortunately, it's compromised, and the gasket needs to be replaced, but a re-torque could maybe help define your problem, and slow down pressurizing, which I suspect to be head gaskets, especially since the system only pressurizes under "high" boost.
 
Last edited:

co04cobra

Active member
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
3,003
Reaction score
10
Location
WV
I was just directed to this thread, and feel inclined to offer a little insight as I put it together. This whole deal building the truck was a pretty costly learning experience for Elite at the time starting with a miscommunication of sorts with our machinist, and the valve seat cutting process. This is the only set of Elite heads I'm aware of this ever happening to. The potential future problem has since been 100% resolved with a new design & process for seat install (improved design for everyone purchasing since that time) The machinist swore he cut them the same depth as he always did, but ended up barely, or almost cutting into the water jackets, which we didn't figure out until test driving when the motor would puff a little coolant smoke on start-up, then run clean, and be great aside from about 1-2 qt loss of coolant every 150 miles or so. Maybe it was a casting flaw, maybe not, but those heads were scrapped.

We didn't figure it out until I pulled the turbos to find moisture in the up pipes. I then pulled the exhaust manifolds, and with the system pressurized, saw coolant coming out of an exhaust port. After the heads were off, we found the leak right at 1 seat on one head, and at 2 on the other. New heads were put on, and shortly after, it started mixing coolant in the oil. This is when I discovered coolant coming up past the head stud threads.

We Teflon coated the leaky ones at the bases, and drove it a little more. If was only using a tiny bit of coolant, (no more from the stud tops) but using it none the less. Time for a new block.

We built an entirely new engine, being extra careful on everything to make it perfect. Here's where the details get a bit fuzzy... iirc, we went back to the old torque spec of 195 lb/ft on the head studs to minimize the possibility of cracks. We tested the truck thoroughly for a couple hundred miles more to be 100% certain that everything was as it should be, and it was.

If I were to guess the problem, I'd say the 195 I think I did just wasn't quite enough to keep the heads seated fully. You might try to go in and re-torque them up a little more (my own opinion, not authorized by Elite) , say 210ish, and run it for a bit to see what happens. Once you lift a head, unfortunately, it's compromised, and the gasket needs to be replaced, but a re-torque could maybe help define your problem, and slow down pressurizing, which I suspect to be head gaskets, especially since the system only pressurizes under "high" boost.




Thanks for shedding some light on the situation Wayne. That is making sense. I am not trying to put a blame on Elite or anybody. Ive built enough stuff to know sh!t happens. The other issues during the build are things I had no knowledge of, and once fixed was probably irrelevant anyway.


Re-torque might be a temporary fix, but I am looking to hopefully put more power to this motor down the road.


I would like to talk to someone from Elite about the issue. Originally it was still under warranty until Dec. The distance between my shop and Elite makes it difficult.


I am more then willing to pull the engine and ship it to Elite, and while it is apart would like to have some upgrades installed on my dime.
 
Top