swinky
New member
His setup on the 66 kinda sucked. A properly setup 366 will spool right with one of them big fancy vgts.
68mm vgt vs s366 opinion.
- Thread starter TBagAMouseTrap
- Start date
04cr450
Active member
^ im sorry bit you are incorrect on that statement. My 68 vgt which was live tuned by eric spools instantly, way different than the non vgt especially a 366
swinky
New member
I guarantee it doesn't spool better than stock and even stock spools like ****.
Exactly why I suggested doing the up-pipes and converter first, before jumping out of the 66 into the 75. That's a pretty large jump.
I would expect a VGT charge to always hold the upper hand in spooling. That's kind of the point. However, I think a non VGT with the proper setup and the proper tuning can be made to work very well. The whole idea of going non VGT is for more power up top, right? Why else? I did mine simply because it was different. It sounds cool, and now I have a bunch of turbo options, most of which are quite a bit less expensive than swapping to a different VGT.
We all know how much tuning wakes up a stock turbo. Just another variable in all of this. Probably a ton of ways to do this "wrong." Unfortunately. I would say my 62 with the tuning combo I have now spools like my untuned stock truck did. It's hard to compare just because they're so different in the way they drive and act, but I bet it spools similar to a stock turbo truck without tuning.
04cr450
Active member
Ok u guarantee, but trust me i know u are biased to non vgt. The tuning is just right with the vgt and I get no lag whatsoever. Sorry but you are off here on what u are talking about with comparing a vgt vs non vgt with correct tuning. With guys listening to this they will think a non vgt is the way to go spool wise and when they get it (as most of them do) they are greatly disappointed and have to learn to drive the truck differently in order to make the non vgt work correctly.
Mike@MPD
New member
It's really not hard to learn to drive a non vgt truck. A properly sized non vgt will be very easy and quick spooling
MrOneEyedBoh
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Whtas the cost versus vgt? Im thinking about going non-vgt, but unsure on the cost. Plus I want to drive in one or drive one to see whats what.
Josh@DirtyDiesels
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All depending on what turbo you do it can be a lot less or a lot more than going VGT. T4 Up pipes are in the $900 range. Then you pick a turbo and go from there....
This weighed heavily in my decision. Ultimately I could have done the non VGT for less money than a larger VGT (not including a powermax), but I went with a better non VGT turbo too (FMW series instead of just a cast 66) and mine had the 360* thrust bearing upgrade. However I purchased it used as well, directly from Matt to save a few bucks. Overall my setup with all new stuff would have been more than just a non VGT, but once you have the pipes and drains and feeds and mount etc.... now you can just buy any T4 flange turbo and drop it in and turbo for turbo the non VGT's are usually less expensive. I have more, less expensive options now.
I think a big part of the problem is it's hard to go directly from a bigger VGT to a non VGT and just do a direct comparison. We've established having the "right" setup for a non VGT is crucial to it's function and we all know the driving styles are different. I know I was a little taken back at first when I put my relatively small non VGT on my truck. It took a week or so of driving before I fell into a habit and really learned how the truck liked to drive. I'm sure guys with more seat time and 10 different turbos or more under their belt can adapt easier. I guess it's all relative though.
Don't quote me, but pretty sure Matt's up-pipes are $550 + $125 core....
Josh@DirtyDiesels
New member
I was going of price for MPD T4 setup. I sell MPD parts when it comes to T4 setups so those are the prices I know LOL. But that price does include oil feed and drain lines and there is NO core charge...
Six_Sloww
New member
If spool is your biggest concern just go VGT and be done.. Non VGT are for those of us who change our goals, and are always seeking more power, you have flexibility with your setup and when setup properly you can still have a very streetable truck.
MrOneEyedBoh
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Alright. I was planning on going with a 68mm. Im running 190/75s from MPD, so 68 would be my max if I were going non-vgt.
MrOneEyedBoh
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Yeah Id go MPD just because they are less than 10 mins away. And they did my engine work and injectors. Id like to keep it all the same, shop wise if possible.
You get both sides of the fence on VGT vs non-VGT as always. It really doesnt matter how much reading you do it seems, some prefer and other dont. Thats just it.. Its a preference on what to do and how to go about it. I just need to drive one to see how unstreeable one can be. When I went from an 06 to an 03 turbo, I most def felt the difference. But it was very easy to adapt to the change in spool etc. Non-VGT cant be that much worse.. Can it?
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swinky
New member
No lag whatsoever? That's just retarded to say. I'm sure it spools good and I'm glad you love your setup but I've seen more people disappointed in big vgt spool than non vgt. At the end of the day it's personal preference but for what I do a vgt is just a waste of money and I think they sound like chit compared to a non vgt.
Stroker04
New member
If I was to do it over again, I would probably do a barder stage 3 for sure..
Cutting-Edge Diesel
Active member
$650 no core now
andrewsteelerford05
New member
I run a non vgt s475 custom built by Barder on the street and if I have to I can run it as a dd. Non vgt can be very streetable get it tuned right.
TBagAMouseTrap
New member
I started this thread because I'm sure many on here are curious the difference in vgt vs non but can't throw money into both setups to test out. I wanted to state my unbiased opinion as I don't make a living selling turbos. I have ran the factory 04, an 03, a powermax, a barder stage 3, and now a s366, all of which with 190 injectors. How many who praise the non vgt went from stocker to a borg? How many went from big vgt to an s300 or vice versa? Reasons I went 68vgt was it was simple to bolt on, made good power, ran mid 12s, spanked deleted 6.4s on the street and track, didn't require supporting mods (tq converter, up pipes). In my personal opinion as of right now there isn't a better dd/weekend warrior setup. Reasons I swapped to non vgt, I have $750 in the turbo and mount, I eventually wanted more power than the barder could support, didn't like the turbo whine from the barder, I figured I could get into the 366 cheaply(with similar results to the 68vgt) to hold me over while i built a non vgt setup around it then swap to a bigger turbo. And honestly can anyone blame me for trading a box s366+$200 for a custom built s475? I know it will be lag city compared to the s366 but I wanted to go bigger eventually anyways, why not take advantage of a good deal. In my opinion the average 6.0 owner looking for a fun truck without headaches should just stick to a vgt.
johnp115
Active member
Your initial post sounded like my opinion of the 66 i had. Honestly made me question a dead turbo and it probably was. Different people like different things. Had i had more time and money i definitely would have given the non vgt more of a shot, just couldn't afford to try a bunch of changes
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