Time for more air... 71mm vgt & 86mm S510

[OOWeaver68]

Damn, Fuel system stuff in the library says nothing about the temp sensor.

 

[Dzchey21]

no thats what i have been looking at as well as the electrical system, no dice.

Im gunna delete it... **** it, if it gets hot ill do something different

 

[OOWeaver68]

Wouldn't be hard to do the radiator type cooler along the framerail if it does get hot.

 

[Dzchey21]

Wouldn't be hard to do the radiator type cooler along the framerail if it does get hot.

no and the local napa sells universal coolers for about 60-80 bucks, with brackets and stuff, thats what i m going to do if need be, tomorrow im gunna rip that stuff off and get fittings to make it all work

 

[powr2stroke]

only thing i've found Dustin is that fuel cooler is designed to keep the fuel at or below 158* at the inlet to hpfp . Couldnt find anything on a sensor

 

[Dzchey21]

only thing i've found Dustin is that fuel cooler is designed to keep the fuel at or below 158* at the inlet to hpfp . Couldnt find anything on a sensor

thats good enough for me.. thanks... its getting deleted on that note. thats way higher than i have ever seen for fuel temps, i bet the pump has never kicked on.

And that does answer my question, that tells me the ecm is looking at inlet fuel temperature and cooling the return fuel to achieve cooler than 158 degrees, makes sense now. thanks for that info

 

[Erikclaw]

I was looking through my tech manuals and I didn't see any type of thermostat or sensor. Since the coolant flows from the fuel radiator in the front and it uses coolant. You think it just circulates freely through the system?

 

[01platinum]

Dustins this thing is looking sick. Sounds like you have it figured out or are figuring it out as you go along.

 

[Heavyhaul]

Delete it. The temps are still going to be high no matter what. Its a towing thing. Keep you tank a 1/4 full while towing and use cetane booster to help with the heat if you tow. Other than that I think it will be fine. Remember the n14. They used to use fuel to cool the processor before it entered the motor. As long as you have enough fuel in your tank to cool off before it comes back to the motor it should be fine.

Edit.
N-14 owners were also told to keep it above a 1/4 of a tank. Also my question is do you return more fuel with the duel fuelers?

 

[Charles]

How come no one does it that way, or at least I haven't seen it? All my piping were Jet Hot ceramic coated, never was told about doing only the insides and not the outer.

Two main reasons...

One... most people are dumb. Yep. Most people don't UNDERSTAND the point of the damn coatings. They are thermal barrier coatings. That means that if you place them on the inside of the piece, they will contain the heat just the same, yet do so BEFORE it reaches the part itself, as opposed to doing so after. Secondly, if you put the barrier on the exterior of the part it then becomes a barrier to the ability of the PART to radiate away it's own heat, causing the average temperature of that part to increase, sometimes dramatically. And with increased part temperatures you get closer and closer to the point where the service life of the part, based on material used and loads imposed gets shorter than what's acceptable. Instead of 20 years, it might be 5, or 5 months.... or if stressed hard enough, 5 minutes...

This is also what wrap does, but it also adds the bonus of kicking corrosion in to high gear. This is why ANY major header manufacturer will 100% void your warranty the SECOND you wrap their parts. They're tired of warrantying other people's mistakes.

Second reason you don't see internal coatings more often.... most people don't use ceramic coatings for their "ceramic" coatings, lol. Most of them in the 0.002" thickness are really just a high temp paint for the most part. If this is used on the inside it will flake off and be gone in no time. Then they will be faced with redoing someones parts again and again, as well as possibly lose business over it.... so.... they say F it and just don't do it.

However.... SOME of them actually use ceramic coatings, or at least CAN... and IF these people ALSO have a pair of nuts in their pants, they can blast the good sh*t into the ports or ends and then swirl the part all around and coat the inside with excellent coverage. And I have YET to see the stuff flake and I've been running it on the insides of parts for 3 or 4 years now.

The stuff my guy uses is called "white lightning" IIRC. It's f'ing thick. Looks nothing like the sh*t that people put on the outsides.



Lastly..... I don't thick there's as much radiant heat leaving these parts as everybody thinks in the first place. I had a 304 SS pipe leaving the GT47 that ran within 1/8 of an inch from my PLASTIC heater box for literally 2 or 3 years of hard daily driving, including heavy towing and it never showed any signs of an issue.

 

[Charles]

Found some similar sentiment from a leader in the industry.... Jet Hot...

Jet-Hot points out that realizing the full anti-corrosion benefits of header coatings requires coating the headers on their inside as well as outside surfaces. Not all competitors coat the inside surfaces, which isn’t good because exhaust gases themselves contain corrosive compounds. If the inside isn’t coated, the header eventually rusts through from the inside out. Coating only the outside can also cause another problem: Mild steel tubing fatigues when it gets too hot. An outer-only thermal barrier blocks the heat from radiating through the exterior metal surface, while the lack of an inner barrier exposes the metal to added “trapped” heat. In a scenario reminiscent of that caused by the dreaded “curse of the mummified headers” (outer cloth wraps used by some racers), the result can be literal disintegration of the mild-steel tubing.

Read more: http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/high_tech_ceramic_coatings/index.html#ixzz1Ud1tkPBL

Spot on.



I built a tiny little header for an ATV I made one time that was a 630cc two cylinder powered side-by-side. I ran the header for at least a year or so without any issue whatsoever. At night it would glow bright red as the little engine tore through mud holes and muddy pastures, yet it never showed even the slightest signs of fatigue, as I said, for a year or more. When my wife rode with me she complained about the heat on longer rides, so the day before a ride one weekend I wrapped the entire system with good, quality wrap. Did an excellent job and it was nice and cleanly done.

Roughly 2 hours into the ride, on a header that had shown perfect resilience for hundreds of rides previously..... the header had overheated to such an extent that it mechanically failed. The wrap was literally the only thing still holding it together... It cracked in multiple places and broke clean in two at another.

A header that was perfectly fine for tons of rides was 100% destroyed in a matter of hours after the wrap started trapping the heat in, overheating the part.


It's not rocket science. Take one guy and put him in 100 degree heat with shorts and a T-shirt on and then take another wearing a black Fur coat and ski-bibs.

Work each of them hard. Which one has a stroke first, lol.

 

[Erikclaw]

Second reason you don't see internal coatings more often.... most people don't use ceramic coatings for their "ceramic" coatings, lol. Most of them in the 0.002" thickness are really just a high temp paint for the most part. If this is used on the inside it will flake off and be gone in no time. Then they will be faced with redoing someones parts again and again, as well as possibly lose business over it.... so.... they say F it and just don't do it.

I hope this isn't true. For the price Jet Hot charges for their hi temp coating I am going to be pissed if your statement is correct.

Just saw the Jet Hot quote, well then maybe mine is done correctly since they made the statement. Hopefully they practice what they preach.

 

[Powerstroked162]

Frame rail cooler is what I'd do Dustin. I think I have a dmax cooler laying around somewhere in the shop. I'll look for you

 

[SSpeeDEMONSS]

Found some similar sentiment from a leader in the industry.... Jet Hot...





Spot on.



I built a tiny little header for an ATV I made one time that was a 630cc two cylinder powered side-by-side. I ran the header for at least a year or so without any issue whatsoever. At night it would glow bright red as the little engine tore through mud holes and muddy pastures, yet it never showed even the slightest signs of fatigue, as I said, for a year or more. When my wife rode with me she complained about the heat on longer rides, so the day before a ride one weekend I wrapped the entire system with good, quality wrap. Did an excellent job and it was nice and cleanly done.

Roughly 2 hours into the ride, on a header that had shown perfect resilience for hundreds of rides previously..... the header had overheated to such an extent that it mechanically failed. The wrap was literally the only thing still holding it together... It cracked in multiple places and broke clean in two at another.

A header that was perfectly fine for tons of rides was 100% destroyed in a matter of hours after the wrap started trapping the heat in, overheating the part.


It's not rocket science. Take one guy and put him in 100 degree heat with shorts and a T-shirt on and then take another wearing a black Fur coat and ski-bibs.

Work each of them hard. Which one has a stroke first, lol.

maybe im lucky then. ive wrapped my 426 header and my CRF50(106 big bore/stroker) header for years and both are still in great shape.

Garrett

 

[Dzchey21]

Charles

Im going to take your advice, im getting ahold of a company in denver that uses a jet hot like coating but claim its better, ill get more info and post it up, but Hallers ran into them at a car show and they said that you could set your hand on a fully hot pipe and not burn yourself.

I did make a little progress, i got my twin elite pipe welded back up, got a start on the big turbo oulet pipe and i think i can sneak the hot pipe in and still run the factory oil fill and crank vent, but im going to add another crankcase vent to the other valve cover.

Also I just set the little turbo in to get an idea bout my injection lines for the cp3, fuel lines to the ford pump, and fuel cooler delete, fuel cooler delete is really going to help, the pipe to the small turbo is still gunna suck but at least i can make it one piece now.


*** this thing is going to be the end of me LOL


Here is a couple quick pics

 

[Heavyhaul]

Looking good!

 

[PTSUPERD]

Looking good!!!

 

[bigrpowr]

it should be running by now, right? looks ready to go.

 

[Dzchey21]

not even close, i suppose i could build everything test it, then strip it to get coated but im not going to do that. still lots of **** to do, wanna try to go racing at the end of the month, thats my only goal at this point

 

[jdgleason]

Lookin clean buddy!